Survival rotation for 2 targets

[Iridar 80]

This question has been raised a lot lately, so I have done some extensive simcrafting to find the best shot priority.

Disclaimer: all testing was done for my current gear. Your mileage may vary depending on your gear. 

 

General notes:

• Try to cast Black Arrow on a target that will live through full duration. 
• Change target after each Arcane Shot to ensure maximum Serpent Sting duration on all targets.
• A Murder of Crows that will last 5+ seconds worth more than Arcane Shot + full duration of Serpent Sting. So don't hesitate to cast AMoC on a target that's about to die. 
• If Explosive Trap will hit only one target, cast it after spending your TotH proc (this is just a hunch). 

 

Lone Wolf, 2 targets:

 

1) A Murder of Crows / Black Arrow / Explosive Shot

2) Apply Serpent Sting to both targets with Arcane Shot and refresh when it has <3 sec left

3) Throw Explosive Trap if it will hit both targets

4) Spend Thrill of the Hunt proc on Arcane Shot. 

5) Barrage*

6) Cast Arcane Shot if you have >78 focus.

7) Gain focus with Cobra Shot. 

 

* For LW, Barrage is a VERY minor DPS increase on two targets. Depending on individual gear may even come out as a DPS loss. I do not recommend casting Barrage on two targets, but if you do - this is the place to do it. 

 

Focusing Shot, 2 targets:

 

1) A Murder of Crows / Black Arrow / Explosive Shot

2) Apply Serpent Sting to both targets with Multi Shot and refresh when it has <3 sec left

3) Throw Explosive Trap if it will hit both targets

4) Barrage*

5) Spend Thrill of the Hunt proc on Multi Shot. 

6) Cast Multi Shot if you have >40 focus.

7) Gain focus with Focusing Shot. 

 

* For FS, Barrage is a major DPS increase. Make sure to use it on cooldown.  

 

If second target is out of Multi Shot's reach, just cast Arcane Shot instead. 

-----

 

Pretty much all of this is just common sense / already in the guides, but nice to reconfirm once in a while. 

 

Was surprised to see the huge gap in Barrage's usefulness between LW (+50 DPS) and FS (+1300 DPS). We'll have to take this into account when we talk about Barrage in the future.

Edited January 23, 2015 by Iridar

[kevow 0]

What im always wondering is why not choose multi shot over arcane shot for SS? It costs more focus, but 2 arcane shots cost more, plus more time or am i wrong?(im asking this because allot of people do AS over MS on 2 targets)

[Iridar 80]

What im always wondering is why not choose multi shot over arcane shot for SS? It costs more focus, but 2 arcane shots cost more, plus more time or am i wrong?(im asking this because allot of people do AS over MS on 2 targets)

It is actually an interesting question, and apparently you're on to something here.

For Focusing Shot, Multi Shot is a big DPS gain over Arcane Shot even on just two targets (+600 DPS). 

 

For Lone Wolf Multi Shot is a DPS loss on 2 targets.

 

Gonna edit the OP.

Edited January 22, 2015 by Iridar

[Minigun 1]

According to my 2 boss sim. 

 

LW SV:

Barrage only gains 400 dps over no tier 6.

Glaive Toss gains 500 dps over no tier 6. 

 

From my experience with LW SV it's hard to pool 60 focus on a fight like twins, and generally doesn't feel worth it.  Despite the bosses not being stacked some of the time, GT seems like a superior choice in that situation.

Edited January 22, 2015 by Minigun

[Azortharion 60]

1) Exotic Munitions beat Lone Wolf on 2 targets by a significant margin, 800 DPS or so.

 

2) The best 2-target setup (Thrill,Stampede, Barrage, LW) is like 600 DPS ahead of not using any secondary at all.

 

3) The highest non-FS setup sims 1.6k over the highest EM setup (which actually has Dire Beast).

[wickedsymphony 1]

Sorry for reviving a somewhat old thread but my question fits pretty good in here so I didn't want to open another one.

I'm currently raiding in SV spec with Barrage, TotH and LW.

In the case of a TotH proc (or in general, actually), what's the minimum number of targets I need to have, so that it makes more sense to use Multi Shot instead of Arcane Shot?

Concerning Barrage: I've read above that using it in combination with LW on two targets results in a damage loss, so I'm guessing that from three targets upwards it would increase damage. Correct?

[Orthios 271]

Sorry for reviving a somewhat old thread but my question fits pretty good in here so I didn't want to open another one.

I'm currently raiding in SV spec with Barrage, TotH and LW.

In the case of a TotH proc (or in general, actually), what's the minimum number of targets I need to have, so that it makes more sense to use Multi Shot instead of Arcane Shot?

Concerning Barrage: I've read above that using it in combination with LW on two targets results in a damage loss, so I'm guessing that from three targets upwards it would increase damage. Correct?

With TotH procs, 2 targets.  For barrage, yes you'll want at least 3 targets if you're using LW (though I would never advise using LW due to its focus starvation, and in any AoE scenario FS takes the lead by quite a lot).

[wickedsymphony 1]

With TotH procs, 2 targets.  For barrage, yes you'll want at least 3 targets if you're using LW (though I would never advise using LW due to its focus starvation, and in any AoE scenario FS takes the lead by quite a lot).

Thanks for your quick answer.

I've thought about taking FS instead of LW but the loss of movement is worrying me a little. Is FS also the better choice for fights where a lot of movement is required or should one switch to LW (or EM?) for those fights?

[Orthios 271]

Thanks for your quick answer.

I've thought about taking FS instead of LW but the loss of movement is worrying me a little. Is FS also the better choice for fights where a lot of movement is required or should one switch to LW (or EM?) for those fights?

I've yet to encounter a fight where movement was an issue for FS SV.  The only caveat is that I haven't done Blackhand as FS SV.  And EM is only really useful in PvP.

[Iridar 80]

Sorry for reviving a somewhat old thread but my question fits pretty good in here so I didn't want to open another one.

I'm currently raiding in SV spec with Barrage, TotH and LW.

In the case of a TotH proc (or in general, actually), what's the minimum number of targets I need to have, so that it makes more sense to use Multi Shot instead of Arcane Shot?

Concerning Barrage: I've read above that using it in combination with LW on two targets results in a damage loss, so I'm guessing that from three targets upwards it would increase damage. Correct?

Myself I have switched to BM, as it seems to provide better cleave/AOE damage, and I'm sick of playing SV anyway. 

 

But to answer your question, the old guideline is for LW to start using Multi Shot as a focus dump on 3 targets, and on 2 targets for Focusing Shot. Check out the updated priority in Azor's guide. 

 

Don't think of Focusing Shot as limiting your movement, think of it as losing DPS when you need to move. However, in AOE situations Focusing Shot is so far ahead of LW, that that DPS loss is well overcompensated for. Still, that feeling of losing DPS is very annoying, and that's why it was so hard for me to bring myself to play with FS. 

 

Yes, for LW SV Barrage as a focus dump (lowest lowest priority) starts giving DPS only against 3+ targets. The more targets there are, the higher will be Barrage's priority, but overall it is very weak for LW due to overwhelming focus cost. 

[Azortharion 60]

You don't dump @ 2 targets with Multi regardless of talents.