Need advice for our priest dicipline

[Haeckel 1]

Hi guys,

 

I am looking for help to analyze the performance of our dicipline priest, we felt that he should be doing more healing with his ILVL, 

But to be honest I have never used a priest before, so I can not give him any advice on this matter.

 

I see that his uptime on archangel is low, but he says that this is because archangel is a CD for high damage phases(like avenging wrath or tree of life), also he says that is because the other healers that he must play this way; so we are looking for a experienced advice on this matter.

 

I hope you can help us to improve his performance with some advice, or let us know if he is doing everything ok,

 

thanks in advance.

 

His Armory

 

 

 

Our last log: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/Gzqc7m91DQXKVYZT

                    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/DxqL7gNBa2n4VH69

 

 

Note: links fixed

Edited February 18, 2015 by Haeckel

[soonjung 3]

I can't seem to get your log to come up.

[Pandacho 286]

Hi, Haeckel.

 

Here you can see the comparison of your disc logs to mine for the same fights, if it's easier to understand in this way

 

Hans'gar & Franzok:

PW: Solace uptime: your fight was 5:20 min long, with PW:S CD 10 sec, it could be 32, not 10. It is vital to cast PW:S on CD because it's both a mana returning and Evangelism stacks building.

Cascade (25 sec CD): 5 uses, could be 12.

Archangel and Empowered AA - no casts at all which is completely unacceptable. It had to be 10 and 10 casts, with 10 EAA+PoH or Flash Heal casts (for forcing 100% crit. I personally prefer PoH AoE on FH single target)

He hard casts PoM, which is kind of waste of time and mana.

 

Power Infusion: 1 cast, could be 3, should be at least 2.

Pain Suppression: 1 cast, could be 2.

 

He took CoW talent it tier 7, should take WoM, especially that you have holy paladin for tanks healing.

No use of Shadowfiend at all.

 

Oregorger:

PW: Solace uptime: your fight was 7:27 min long, with PW:S CD 10 sec, it could be 44, not 9. 

Cascade (25 sec CD): 6 uses, could be 17.

Archangel and Empowered AA - no casts at all which is completely unacceptable. It had to be 14 and 14 casts, with 14 EAA+PoH casts (for 100% PoH crit)

He hard casts PoM, which is kind of waste of time and mana.

 

Power Infusion: no casts at all - unacceptable,  should be 3.

Pain Suppression: 1 cast, could be 3.

 

He took CoW talent it tier 7, should take WoM, especially that you have holy paladin for tanks healing.

No use of Shadowfiend at all.

 

Beastlord Darmak

PW: Solace uptime: your fight was 10:45 min long, with PW:S CD 10 sec, it could be 64, not 31. 

Cascade (25 sec CD): 11 uses, could be 25.

Archangel and Empowered AA - 4 casts. It had to be at least 20 and 20 casts, with 20 EAA+PoH casts (for 100% PoH crit)

16 casts of  PoM, which is a big waste of time and mana.

 

Power Infusion: 1 cast - unacceptable, should be 5.

Pain Suppression: 2 casts only.

Only 2 dispels and 1 Mass Dispel - very bad, should be at least 10 and 6.

 

He took CoW talent it tier 7, should take WoM, especially that you have holy paladin for tanks healing.

No use of Shadowfiend at all.

 

 

Well, from what I see, the play style of this disc is pretty unacceptable.

If you want more detailed explanations, you welcome

 

Upd: I was able to find his Armory. Is it real - he raids without major glyphs?

[Haeckel 1]

Hi Pandacho,

 

I will tell him to improve on those points that you mention.

 

I only have few more questions.

He told me that he took CoW because the paladin is not doing a good job healing tanks. how i can verify if this is true? I thought that the paladin was doing a good job on the tanks side.

 

also, probably he is not casting AA that much because he considers it more like a raid cooldown, that is not about toping the meters but to keep the people alive, can you explain the proper use of AA? I suppose the best way to use it, is to try to use it on cooldown but if you know that a high raid damage is near save it for that moment.

 

Thanks for your help!

[Pandacho 286]

Hi Pandacho,

 

I will tell him to improve on those points that you mention.

 

I only have few more questions.

He told me that he took CoW because the paladin is not doing a good job healing tanks. how i can verify if this is true? I thought that the paladin was doing a good job on the tanks side.

 

also, probably he is not casting AA that much because he considers it more like a raid cooldown, that is not about toping the meters but to keep the people alive, can you explain the proper use of AA? I suppose the best way to use it, is to try to use it on cooldown but if you know that a high raid damage is near save it for that moment.

 

Thanks for your help!

I'm not sure what does he mean about paladin not doing a good job here. First of all, Beacons are doing sort of 'passive' healing on their targets, redirecting 50% of raid healing to them. So if your paladin was healing the raid and Beacons were on tanks, there is no good or bad healing - it's 50%. I see that all your 3 healers are healing tanks for more or less same amount. Was your holy paladin assigned to tanks healing as a priority? If not, then I'm not sure that we can talk about him doing not a good job.

 

Archangel: it's not a raid CD in any meaning. AA increases disc healing done by 5% for each stack of Evangelism (up to 5 stacks and 25% increased healing). AA is up for 18 sec. and has 30 sec CD. So it's a sort of more or less constant healing buff - you don't use it - you just lose the buff. There is nothing that could be 'saved'. AA could be triggered on any amount of stacks from 1 to 5 and will grant 1 'charge' of Empowered AA which makes next cast of PoH (group AoE heal) or Flash Heal (single target heal) to be 100% crit. Discs are generally agreed that it's better to spend EAA for crit PoH  - it's better to heal 5 people than only one. 

Anyway, there is no reason at all not to cast AA or not to use EAA - it's just a pure waste of buff. You don't use AA - your healing is 5-25% weaker - that's it :)

[Haeckel 1]

thanks for your help pandacho!

 

I will talk to him about this, so he can improve!

[mgibbonsjr 2]

Hi, Haeckel.

 

Here you can see the comparison of your disc logs to mine for the same fights, if it's easier to understand in this way

 

Hans'gar & Franzok:

PW: Solace uptime: your fight was 5:20 min long, with PW:S CD 10 sec, it could be 32, not 10. It is vital to cast PW:S on CD because it's both a mana returning and Evangelism stacks building.

Cascade (25 sec CD): 5 uses, could be 12.

Archangel and Empowered AA - no casts at all which is completely unacceptable. It had to be 10 and 10 casts, with 10 EAA+PoH or Flash Heal casts (for forcing 100% crit. I personally prefer PoH AoE on FH single target)

He hard casts PoM, which is kind of waste of time and mana.

 

Power Infusion: 1 cast, could be 3, should be at least 2.

Pain Suppression: 1 cast, could be 2.

 

He took CoW talent it tier 7, should take WoM, especially that you have holy paladin for tanks healing.

No use of Shadowfiend at all.

 

Oregorger:

PW: Solace uptime: your fight was 7:27 min long, with PW:S CD 10 sec, it could be 44, not 9. 

Cascade (25 sec CD): 6 uses, could be 17.

Archangel and Empowered AA - no casts at all which is completely unacceptable. It had to be 14 and 14 casts, with 14 EAA+PoH casts (for 100% PoH crit)

He hard casts PoM, which is kind of waste of time and mana.

 

Power Infusion: no casts at all - unacceptable,  should be 3.

Pain Suppression: 1 cast, could be 3.

 

He took CoW talent it tier 7, should take WoM, especially that you have holy paladin for tanks healing.

No use of Shadowfiend at all.

 

Beastlord Darmak

PW: Solace uptime: your fight was 10:45 min long, with PW:S CD 10 sec, it could be 64, not 31. 

Cascade (25 sec CD): 11 uses, could be 25.

Archangel and Empowered AA - 4 casts. It had to be at least 20 and 20 casts, with 20 EAA+PoH casts (for 100% PoH crit)

16 casts of  PoM, which is a big waste of time and mana.

 

Power Infusion: 1 cast - unacceptable, should be 5.

Pain Suppression: 2 casts only.

Only 2 dispels and 1 Mass Dispel - very bad, should be at least 10 and 6.

 

He took CoW talent it tier 7, should take WoM, especially that you have holy paladin for tanks healing.

No use of Shadowfiend at all.

 

 

Well, from what I see, the play style of this disc is pretty unacceptable.

If you want more detailed explanations, you welcome

 

Upd: I was able to find his Armory. Is it real - he raids without major glyphs?

Just commenting to say thank you for being so helpful. Haven't seen posts that are so detailed for each fight like this and it is extremely helpful. +1

[Yuufa 1]

It's all well and good saying that Padancho, but you have to keep in mind that there are times when things like casting power infusion just because it's off cool down or pain suppression is essentially a waste and could be needed later in the fight. I agree that because of enhanced archangel, that should be used as and when it's available but not everything in raids are as black or white as that. Same with cascade, I use it often on my priest and usually ends up warranting the majority of my over healing because of the nature of encounters. Really it should only be used when periods of persistent aoe damage is happening and pre shields have been worn out.

I looked through the logs myself and if your discipline priest is your dedicated tank healer then CoW is fine to take, otherwise yes words of mending is better. So that may be an issue, it may not, since some fights warrant using more than just triage healing to keep the tanks up.

Though with twins there should be so many more pw:s casts and he's wasting his time hard casting things like prayer of mending and heal. You take a disco priest for their absorbs not their healing. The nature of the discipline priest means he needs to understand and know the encounters better than other healers, so he can preemptively shield the tanks/raid before that damage comes rather than reacting to it.

If the priest himself or you want to message me on here for a mode in depth discussion, feel free.

I apologise for not being able to give more feedback as I'm using an IPad at work currently.

[Pandacho 286]

It's all well and good saying that Padancho, but you have to keep in mind that there are times when things like casting power infusion just because it's off cool down or pain suppression is essentially a waste and could be needed later in the fight. I agree that because of enhanced archangel, that should be used as and when it's available but not everything in raids are as black or white as that. Same with cascade, I use it often on my priest and usually ends up warranting the majority of my over healing because of the nature of encounters. 

I would argue here. In my opinion, holding back simple AoE heals like Cascade or 100% crit PoH which are available roughly once in 30 sec is a wrong mana management and putting unnecessary pressure on your fellow healers. They are not raid CDs in any way - they just give a possibility to heal 4-5 people in one cast instead of 4-5, which is much more mana efficient. Average hit of Cascade is 6K, average hit of PoH 21K - they are just mana efficient standard heals.

I do not agree about holding of Pain Suppression and PI for some 'later in the fight' too. Every fight has a predictable damage pattern that could be learned and CDs could be planned in advance. There are no fights with the plain low damage until the last part of the encounter. It always has spikes - both tanks and raid wide. On most of the fights AoE raid damage happens at least once in a minute, same with the tank damage that needs externals. You can always find the right times to use PI and PS when studying Damage Taken tab in logs.

 

And so this wouldn't be just words from a person who does not play or raid on a disc priest, here are some examples of my logs where I'm using this playstyle. You can check spell usage and Mana management.

Yesterday - Blast Furnace (N) - log . Place 33 in my bracket.

Yesterday - Gruul (N) - log. Place 196 in my bracket.

Saturday - Kargath (HM) - log. Place 89 in my bracket.