Invoker Thorns Crusader

[Guest Dunaskmey]

How does this build compare to the hammer build? seems like all the top GR saders are all running hammer instead of thorns... i juz completed all the items in this build and luckily i also completed the hammer build set..

[BlossomDead 0]

I have an Aquila Cuirass equipped and I cubed Depth Diggers as an alternative to Heart of Iron.

Is it viable? It seems it does a little more damage.

Edited January 18, 2017 by positiv2
Deleted note

[Neogeo 0]

On 18/01/2017 at 11:11 PM, BlossomDead said:

I have an Aquila Cuirass equipped and I cubed Depth Diggers as an alternative to Heart of Iron.

Is it viable? It seems it does a little more damage.

Invoker damage came from thorn. Depth Digger did not buff thorn damage. You want Sanguinary Vambracer in cube. It will help you clear trash mob much quicker. 

[Zagrash90 4]

Can this build be good for group rifts 65+? I am doing well solo but would like so company from time to time.

Edited February 1, 2017 by Zagrash90

[Guest Lifaen]

Hi, I think I need a bit of help with this build and the way I'm playing it. I can currently clear GR65 but it takes approximately 14 minutes, and I died twice. Here is my charac page, if someone could help me understand what I'm doing wrong, I'd be really glad!

http://eu.battle.net/d3/fr/profile/valentin-2664/hero/87076630

ps: thanks for all the builds presented here, I tried a lot of them and loved them :D

[Zagrash90 4]

7 hours ago, Guest Lifaen said:

Hi, I think I need a bit of help with this build and the way I'm playing it. I can currently clear GR65 but it takes approximately 14 minutes, and I died twice. Here is my charac page, if someone could help me understand what I'm doing wrong, I'd be really glad!

http://eu.battle.net/d3/fr/profile/valentin-2664/hero/87076630

ps: thanks for all the builds presented here, I tried a lot of them and loved them :D

For instance i use Pigsticker and i can clear GR70 and still have time. In ur case put 4 gems in all resist  and instead indestructible passive put finery and good timing with convention of elements with iron skin. I am not an expert but that what would i do if i were u. :)

Edited February 4, 2017 by Zagrash90

[Guest Torhm]

Did you think Sanguinary Vambraces could be better than Heart of Iron in cube ?

Thanks.

[Valks 2,375]

On 1/18/2017 at 0:11 PM, Guest Dunaskmey said:

How does this build compare to the hammer build? seems like all the top GR saders are all running hammer instead of thorns... i juz completed all the items in this build and luckily i also completed the hammer build set..

Hammer is definitely better, Invoker is just a bit more reserved. It's very difficult to die with Invoker, while Hammer can be a bit more squishy at times.

[Valks 2,375]

On 1/18/2017 at 3:11 PM, BlossomDead said:

I have an Aquila Cuirass equipped and I cubed Depth Diggers as an alternative to Heart of Iron.

Is it viable? It seems it does a little more damage.

Yeah, there's not much point in using Diggers. All of your damage is based on your Thorns damage, so it won't affect much.

[Valks 2,375]

On 1/23/2017 at 3:47 AM, Neogeo said:

Invoker damage came from thorn. Depth Digger did not buff thorn damage. You want Sanguinary Vambracer in cube. It will help you clear trash mob much quicker. 

Thanks for helping to answer :)

[Valks 2,375]

On 2/1/2017 at 9:56 AM, Zagrash90 said:

Can this build be good for group rifts 65+? I am doing well solo but would like so company from time to time.

Yes, it could be, but the build itself doesn't really lend well to group play. You rely on people hitting you to do damage in large volumes outside of your generator, but many people will CC during group play.

[Valks 2,375]

On 2/4/2017 at 1:42 PM, Guest Lifaen said:

ps: thanks for all the builds presented here, I tried a lot of them and loved them :D

If you still need help, let me know when you've got your Invoker stuff on. Looks like you've swapped to Hammer now (the correct thing to do).

[Valks 2,375]

On 2/4/2017 at 7:27 PM, Zagrash90 said:

For instance i use Pigsticker and i can clear GR70 and still have time. In ur case put 4 gems in all resist  and instead indestructible passive put finery and good timing with convention of elements with iron skin. I am not an expert but that what would i do if i were u. :)

Thanks for helping with answering that :)

[Valks 2,375]

On 2/9/2017 at 4:33 PM, Guest Torhm said:

Did you think Sanguinary Vambraces could be better than Heart of Iron in cube ?

Thanks.

I've been told by users that they have fixed the bracers, so yes, they would be very good if so.

[Guest Torhm]

17 hours ago, Blainie said:

I've been told by users that they have fixed the bracers, so yes, they would be very good if so.

Thank you for the answer.
What was supposed to be bugged ?

I managed to clear à GR 70 today.
I'm considering swaping to a hammer build now.

PS : Really nice guide, helped me a lot !

[Valks 2,375]

3 hours ago, Guest Torhm said:

What was supposed to be bugged ?

There were loads of issues - low proc rate, terrible RNG streaks, it didn't interact with Invoker, had a tiny radius. As long as this is fixed (a user said it was about 2 weeks ago), then definitely use them. I'd swap to Hammer personally though, as you have said.

[Inso 2]

Hey, haven't played Invoker thorns in a while, last i played Pig Sticker was better off than Hack even though Hack was hotfixed (either last season or the one before it). 

Is it still a better option? (solely due to Attack Speed and more stat rolls).

Appreciate the answer.

[Valks 2,375]

On 2/13/2017 at 2:22 PM, Inso said:

Is it still a better option? (solely due to Attack Speed and more stat rolls).

The new Hack is better, but Pig Sticker is a close second.

[Guest Woodensen]

Hi, i have an akarats awakening with + block chance (total of 24% block chance) and a votoyias spiker with a near perfect roll (str, vit, cdr, all resist, thorns but no block chance).

Which one should i cube? From my observation, AA is much more rarer than votoyias, especially the one with + block chance. Im leaning towards cubing the votoyias.

What do you think?

[Valks 2,375]

34 minutes ago, Guest Woodensen said:

What do you think?

I'd also cube Voto.

[Lunaji 1]

Hello - thank you for this fantastic guide which has helped me in playing effectively in my first season! I have now completed GR75 solo and up to GR80 in group; my crusader is extremely tough, in fact, perhaps too much so. By far the biggest bottleneck is damage. Although the majority of my pieces are ancient and augmented at at least minimum rank (profile; feedback very welcome), whenever I try GR79 or 80 solo, I miss the timer by at least 2-3mins. In fact, I was already able to survive at 80 after clearing 70, but of course the damage was abysmal. It's worth noting that I'm still <800 paragon, so perhaps when I have a lot more raw strength things will change. Until then though, some thoughts:

Shield - CDR vs socket: I was under the impression this had been discussed briefly here, with a recommendation for CDR, however I can't find it. But if I'm not missing something, a socket will also add 1.5% more strength through finery; if sitting at anywhere between 10k-20k str that's 150-300 more, making it for a 430-580 total if socketing a ruby. In contrast, the CDR looks not so necessary, when the cubed Akarat's Awakening helps reset everything quite quickly.

Laws of Justice feels superfluous. They were great at the beginning when doing higher GRs, particularly to cover any downtime of Akarat's Champion. But now that AC is virtually permanently up thanks to aforementioned CD resets, the extra resist and Decaying Strength seem like a complete overkill on toughness: the only danger ever is if attempting to tank too many elite affixes. Perhaps one simple alternative is to swap some diamonds back to rubies. However, how about swapping LoJ for either Laws of Valor, or Consecrate - Bed of Nails? The latter seems to have been a choice in the past - was it nerfed at some point, was it the inability to stack it? Though this is not rooted in numbers, it's just plain more fun to have another damage ability instead of yet more survivability.

As final notes, it really seems like everyone (i.e. youtube, forums, reddit) prefers Sanguinary Vambraces to Heart of Iron nowadays; I'm waiting for a well-rolled Aquiline Cuirass to try it again, but for the moment it hasn't made a difference for me.

Pig sticker vs Hack is another toss up, but I have gotten the impression of a slight preference for the former. It is not clear to me which one is superior at single-target dps; but if cutting down elites and RG are the most critical parts of a run, then surely the choice should be the best one at that?

Thank you again!

Edited February 17, 2017 by Lunaji

[Guest Daemon]

I saw it mentioned in this thread a while ago, maybe more, I didn't read all of the posts, the helm and the pants both list ALL RESIST as a stat priority but they cannot roll that stat. Maybe they used to be able to but it should be removed. I used up a bunch of mats on my helm trying to get ALL-RESIST before I realized it can't roll. I have been using LIFE-ON-HIT instead. The Pants are a bit harder, but it seems like instead of ALL-RESIST, you can pick either ARMOR or LIFE-PER-SECOND. I lean toward the LPS, personally. The pants can roll  PUNISH DMG but since, from what I understand, Invoker set and Hack are proc'ed by the attack and not part of the attack, PUNISH DMG will do almost nothing for the build.

[Lunaji 1]

You can't roll all-resist as a primary stat if the item has a resist as secondary.

[Lunaji 1]

For what it's worth, completed GR80 today, while still under 800 paragon (hit it on completion!) and no real upgrade since the last post. Used Consecrate - Bed of Nails instead of Laws of Justice and the run was deathless.

Laws of Valor - Invincible also cut it very close on several attempts.

The successful run was done with Hack and Heart of Iron as per the guide, after experimentations with Pig Sticker, Sanguinary Vambraces and even Nemesis. Ultimately, how good the rift is may well be a more important factor than the choices among these - they all seem viable with no groundbreaking differences.

The only other difference was using Draw and Quarter instead of Endurance for Steed Charge (idea picked up from youtube).

[Guest Goose]

I love the guides. Thank you very much. They have been helping me greatly. I am posting this here as I am working on my Thorns Crusadger. Could you possibly add a mention for each build, what Legendary Potion you recommend please? I am currently using the Bottomless Potion of the Leech which bsaed upon my limited knowledge, calculates out better for me with the fast attack than using the Bottomless Potion of Amplification. Would just like some guidance on this matter. Thank you again!