A little confused about Pandemic and my DoTs

[Nobleshield 15]

So I just hit 90 last night (yay me) and working on running heroics and doing Isle of Thunder dailies, trying to work on my DPS as I can't seem to squeeze past like 28k but to be fair I'm in mostly blues + greens (had a friend make me the epic chest + gloves, and I tagged a Sha kill to get the boots). I'm just a little bit confused about how Pandemic works and about refreshing of DoTs in general, so could someone clarify for me:

1) To get the most out of Pandemic, I should refresh my DoTs when the time remaining is 50% or less of the max duration (e.g. Corruption lasts 18 seconds, so it should be refreshed when <= 9s remaining). Other than the higher resulting duration of refreshing as close to 50% max as possible, are there any specific circumstances for when to refresh, or as long as the DoT doesn't drop off?

2) I'm totally confused about the concept of "snapshotting" DoTs (this is my first caster and my first real DoT based class). If I understand correctly, when I have certain procs/buffs (for instance Dark Soul: Misery with its +30% Haste) if my DoTs are applied they will carry over those heightened stats, and thus hit harder? Because of that, at the start of a pull I should always apply Dark Soul (and hopefully get a proc or two), prepot, etc. and THEN use my DoTs so they are better than average?

This next part is what confused me. If I refresh my DoTs, are they overwritten (taking into account Pandemic, of course) or do they retain the snapshot? In other words let's say I pop Dark Soul: Misery and use my Soulburn/Swap macro to get Agony/Corruption/Unstable rolling on a boss with the +30% Haste. When Dark Soul is about to expire, I know to refresh them so I get another 20+ seconds of DoTs with +30% Haste. What about after that time? If I refresh them AGAIN (after Dark Soul is gone, this would be my third refresh) would they be overwritten with my base stats (barring any procs ofc) and be weaker than they were before, or would it just extend the duration of what they were with Dark Soul for those first two times?

I guess what I'm asking is under ideal conditions, how do I handle that third refresh? Do I let the DoTs drop off completely and reapply them? Do I still refresh them while <= 50% max duration so I can benefit from pandemic?

Oh, and one last non-DoT related question. Is Grimoire of Sacrifice better than Supremacy, or does it depend on the fight? I normally rock Supremacy with the Observer, but I read somewhere that Sacrifice is better (and you don't have to worry about a pet dying and having to waste time resummoning him)?

Edited April 27, 2013 by wayniac

[gahhda 95]

You don't want to refresh @ 50% unless you have int/haste procs/cds. Otherwise you use the old system of waiting until they're about to fall off. You want to keep the most buffed dots rolling the longest, so if you had more spell power when you cast the dot, you let it tick until its about to fall.

To quote evrelia, who knows more about affli than me: "Default opener is Haunt - Dark Soul - SB:SS (to apply dots) - Malefic Grasp until procs are up - SB:SS again (to improve the dots). Keep Haunt up for the full duration of these strong DoTs and channel Malefic Grasp."

We're going to be adding opener sections to each of the warlock guides as part of our further revisions.

Every time you cast the dot it gets a new snapshot.

[Cedrin 3]

Your ticking dots dont gain strength with procs alone. If something procs like jade spirit, you have to refresh your dots to gain that added strength on current dots. You always want to let these empowered dots tick for duration without letting them run out completely, especially agony. There is a very good affliction guide on the forums written by zagam.

I always use sacrifice with my affliction spec. I recommend picking up affdots addon to keep track of your dot times and strengths. It's handly to see dot strengths if you refresh current dots. never want to let agony stop off as its a large dps loss. Main thing like stated before me is let your empowered dots tick for duration, refreshing right before they stop off. Most causes save shards for haunt. Drain soul replaces malefic grasp at 20% health. Shouldn't be used any other time.

[Nobleshield 15]

Okay so when I get a proc, the DoT snapshots them when they are refreshed (assuming I still have the proc). So it makes sense if I get certain procs to refresh my DoTs at that point so they benefit from it, but otherwise I'm good as long as I refresh them before they fall off completely (I know in the old days there used to be "clipping", and I think that's what is messing me up. That was removed right?). As far as what procs then, only Int/Haste procs affect the DoTs then, yes? So if I had a mastery or crit proc I could just refresh the dot when its about to expire and basically ignore the proc (like I said I just hit 90 the other day so I have like two green trinkets from questing right now, I think one is haste and one is mastery)?

I do use AffDots (or try to anyways) and I know it color codes dots for "Refresh now" or whatever, but even so I'd rather learn the how and why without just relying on an addon so the addon becomes a tool and not a crutch.

[obleak 10]

Yes Affdots makes affliction a joke Sometimes if you're like me with Wooshos and Breath of Hydra both proc i will let build to maximum stacks of Wooshos and then snapshot the dots by Sb:Ss Then every dot you have is snopshotted at maximum potential especially if i combine that with Dark Soul and i can either MG a ton or Drain Soul and then my dps will go up up up :)

Edited April 28, 2013 by obleak

[Cedrin 3]

Okay so when I get a proc, the DoT snapshots them when they are refreshed (assuming I still have the proc). So it makes sense if I get certain procs to refresh my DoTs at that point so they benefit from it, but otherwise I'm good as long as I refresh them before they fall off completely (I know in the old days there used to be "clipping", and I think that's what is messing me up. That was removed right?). As far as what procs then, only Int/Haste procs affect the DoTs then, yes? So if I had a mastery or crit proc I could just refresh the dot when its about to expire and basically ignore the proc (like I said I just hit 90 the other day so I have like two green trinkets from questing right now, I think one is haste and one is mastery)?

I do use AffDots (or try to anyways) and I know it color codes dots for "Refresh now" or whatever, but even so I'd rather learn the how and why without just relying on an addon so the addon becomes a tool and not a crutch.

I think only haste and int snapshot. I edited post for some possible misinformation Edited April 29, 2013 by Cedrin

[Zagam 1,982]

Haste, Mastery, Crit, and Spell Power are all snap-shotted when DoTs are cast. DoTs are not about how long you have DoTs running. It's about having the strongest DoTs possible ticking. Visit the Affliction guide I wrote that mentions all of these details about snap-shotting as well as proper use of Pandemic.

[JvChequer 43]

Haste, Mastery, Crit, and Spell Power are all snap-shotted when DoTs are cast. DoTs are not about how long you have DoTs running. It's about having the strongest DoTs possible ticking. Visit the Affliction guide I wrote that mentions all of these details about snap-shotting as well as proper use of Pandemic.

BTW, you already see the Soul Swap bug?

Evrealia made a video about it

That's huge bro:

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=xvgzQGzjLQg

Edited April 29, 2013 by JvChequer

[Zagam 1,982]

I can't hear what he's saying in the video while at work...what's going on that he's getting the extra damage?

[Zagam 1,982]

OH SHIT SON, I see what's going on. HOLY SHIT ON A CRACKER! I think that explains how Jelloslock did 296k DPS on LFR Will of the Emperor. I was wondering how he got 80% Crit ticks on all of his stuff. This is money...time to abuse for a while...I think this is going to make our Heroic Megaera attempts MUCH easier this week.

[Zagam 1,982]

If this gets fixed during maintenance this week, I will be greatly saddened. I always wanted a bug like the infinite-Censure stacking Paladin DPS for Warlocks. Apparently it's out...I just want to play with it...just once...

Video for those out of the loop:

[Cruzan 71]

time to have some fun! Edited April 29, 2013 by Cruzan

[Omaric 246]

ERMAHGERD!!!!!!! Don't fix Blizz k thx!

[gahhda 95]

I've known about the bug for awhile *Sigh*. Was hoping none of the top locks would bring it up. Affliction nerf inc :3.

[Omaric 246]

I've known about the bug for awhile *Sigh*. Was hoping none of the top locks would bring it up. Affliction nerf inc :3.

Y U NO TELL ME!? /endfriend

[Zagam 1,982]

Tested it last night...definitely works. I'll know rather quickly if it works on Megaera or not.

[JvChequer 43]

I'll test it today if not fixed.

Hope they did not fix it, that's pretty much huge.

[obleak 10]

Time allows it. Why should it be nerfed. Its taking what blizz gave us and using it creatively

[Zagam 1,982]

It should be nerfed because it's not utilizing the game mechanics properly. It is definitely not intended, nor should it be, to snapshot your empowered DoTs and maintain them via Soul Swap:Inhale/Exhale.

[Omaric 246]

Please let me know if it's working ASAP so I can meditate and remember how to play Affliction, lol.

[JvChequer 43]

It should be nerfed because it's not utilizing the game mechanics properly. It is definitely not intended, nor should it be, to snapshot your empowered DoTs and maintain them via Soul Swap:Inhale/Exhale.

Indeed.

The "intended version" probably it's Inhale and exhale interact dinamically with your dots, as Affdots show us.

[Zagam 1,982]

I won't be home and done with my workout til about 6p Eastern. Even if it's working, it's best not to get tied up to that playstyle as it surely won't last. Blizzard/Ghostcrawler have even talked on Twitter about removing snapshotting going forward. Hard to say if it'll be done in 5.3 (HUGELY doubtful), but it's something to start considering thinking about.

[gahhda 95]

I won't be home and done with my workout til about 6p Eastern. Even if it's working, it's best not to get tied up to that playstyle as it surely won't last. Blizzard/Ghostcrawler have even talked on Twitter about removing snapshotting going forward. Hard to say if it'll be done in 5.3 (HUGELY doubtful), but it's something to start considering thinking about.

And with it, kill all dot specs in the game. Yea, because thats a good design.

Lets remove auto attack from melee while we're at it.

Edited April 30, 2013 by gahhda

[JvChequer 43]

Remove Snapshot from Affliction it'll benefit the newbies wich don't know how to use your procs and make affliction hyper faceroll. That's pretty much a shame.

Btw, the bug still worked after today's patch.

[Omaric 246]

Btw, the bug still worked after today's patch.

Yay!!!

Edited April 30, 2013 by Omaric