Assassination Rogue 7.3

[Furty 51]

15 hours ago, SqueezeBox said:

Unbuffed:

Agi: 25.095
Critical Strike: 9.029
Mastery: 6284

Also; I'm running Agonizing Poison- or would Exsanguinate with Deadly Poison be better? (I would be very surprised, on dummies AP outperforms Exs + DP by alot)

The reason I'm asking is, I'm doing about 290-320k dps on a single target fight (lets say first boss HC EN) but it feels low. I've seen rogues putting out about 60-100k more. With 100k being they have the legendary bracers.. but 100k.. rly?

Thanks in advance!

Personally I would expect Exsang to pull slightly better numbers at this level of gear. No exact math to confirm but my rough estimation for AP to become "dominant" is around ~9k Mastery more.

[worgsn 0]

On 14.11.2016 at 9:56 AM, Furty said:

Personally I would expect Exsang to pull slightly better numbers at this level of gear. No exact math to confirm but my rough estimation for AP to become "dominant" is around ~9k Mastery more.

Its not true, you dont really need that much mastery if u have crit.
he probably has bad legendary and thats all

[Valks 2,375]

On 13.11.2016 at 6:24 PM, SqueezeBox said:

The reason I'm asking is, I'm doing about 290-320k dps on a single target fight (lets say first boss HC EN) but it feels low. I've seen rogues putting out about 60-100k more. With 100k being they have the legendary bracers.. but 100k.. rly?

Keep in mind that you might just be playing the spec wrong. I know this sounds like I'm just pointing fingers and blaming you for the low DPS, but we don't know much about how you are playing. Logs are always important if your question stems from wanting to know why your DPS is low.

[Guest Intangible]

I'm not really sure whats going on but...

 

Im 33% critical, 110% mastery, 7% haste, 10% versatility.

Going master poison/Ap and I was struggling to hit 175k DPs.

Swapped to elaborate/exsang and I was easily 275k with 350-400k burst.

 

I tried to sim my DPS by swapping stats around but couldn't figure out how.

[Guest Elinkar]

Probably SUPER dumb question, but I'm lvl 33 and just curious about gems. How do they work? I don't even see any "gem slots" in any of my items. Not sure if that comes later or if I need to do something?

[Carrn 284]

4 hours ago, Guest Elinkar said:

Probably SUPER dumb question, but I'm lvl 33 and just curious about gems. How do they work? I don't even see any "gem slots" in any of my items. Not sure if that comes later or if I need to do something?

yeah it comes later, don't worry about it for now

[Guest Trouble]

ilvl 851

Mastery 150%

Crit 24%

Haste 11%

Vers 2%

If I understand what I am reading, I should drop some mastery and pick up some crit?

[Carrn 284]

On 06/12/2016 at 1:48 AM, Guest Trouble said:

ilvl 851

Mastery 150%

Crit 24%

Haste 11%

Vers 2%

If I understand what I am reading, I should drop some mastery and pick up some crit?

Your crit is very low. Initially you should drop Haste, but some Mastery as well yes.

[Valks 2,375]

On 11/26/2016 at 9:53 PM, Guest Intangible said:

I tried to sim my DPS by swapping stats around but couldn't figure out how.

Essentially, there isn't much that anyone can do to help without seeing a log of you playing. It might be that you were just playing one of the builds completely wrong. I'm not saying it is 100% the problem, but it could be.

[worgsn 0]

Have you guys tried playing with Insignia of Ravenholdt + Duswalker's Footpads + Vigor talent + 3MA Traits on Agonizing Poison? This combo sounds extremly interesting for Mythic raids, as it currently allows you to have biggest uptime on Elaborate Planning, a lot of more Poison Bomb procs, and is extremly good for cleave, since you dont have to wait eternity for your Agonizing Poison to stack. You also get to use Vendetta VERY often.  Any ideas? Does it sound like something viable to you? Or maybe with Deeper Stratagem + Zoldyck Family Shackles the DPS outcome SHOULD (because for me it isn't) be any bigger than that? I also believe this might become on-go since Deeper Stratagem is getting a little nerf, and Rupture tweak should buff this^ build's damage a little.  I'm open for criticism, and i'm really thankful for any help. 

[Carrn 284]

On 12/16/2016 at 6:55 PM, worgsn said:

Have you guys tried playing with Insignia of Ravenholdt + Duswalker's Footpads + Vigor talent + 3MA Traits on Agonizing Poison? This combo sounds extremly interesting for Mythic raids, as it currently allows you to have biggest uptime on Elaborate Planning, a lot of more Poison Bomb procs, and is extremly good for cleave, since you dont have to wait eternity for your Agonizing Poison to stack. You also get to use Vendetta VERY often.  Any ideas? Does it sound like something viable to you? Or maybe with Deeper Stratagem + Zoldyck Family Shackles the DPS outcome SHOULD (because for me it isn't) be any bigger than that? I also believe this might become on-go since Deeper Stratagem is getting a little nerf, and Rupture tweak should buff this^ build's damage a little.  I'm open for criticism, and i'm really thankful for any help. 

Other than Vigor, you're correct - having 3 MA relics is great, but really only if you have 3 because it helps your cooldowns line up better. With the legendary boots factored in I'm not sure how low you can get the cd on Vend, but it may very well end up making 3MA relics overkill. I haven't run Sims on this myself and I don't play Sin to test this though

Deeper Stratagem is the best option though, and I expect it to remain so over the course of the coming patch. So much of your damage comes from Rupture, that I would expect any talent which buffs that to remain the best one to take. We shall see though.

[Guest Aroarian]

For the trinket list, are the item ilvls on them correct? Is an 860 eye of command more dps then a 880 tirathon's betrayal?

[Carrn 284]

20 hours ago, Guest Aroarian said:

For the trinket list, are the item ilvls on them correct? Is an 860 eye of command more dps then a 880 tirathon's betrayal?

Probably, yes, especially for single target.

EoC will give a huge amount of crit % on 1 target, which is very beneficial. Once you auto another target, you lose the buff, which means you have to be careful when applying Rupture to new targets

[Wintercurse 0]

hi

need help to improve my dps, here is my log on hero guarm    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/ZcfJy8rVvLM9HR7B, i think my opener is good but idk why my rank is low. i think my rank on that fight was 18

Edited December 23, 2016 by Wintercurse

[Carrn 284]

1 minute ago, Wintercurse said:

hi

need help to improve my dps, here is my log on hero guarm    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/ZcfJy8rVvLM9HR7B, i think my opener is good but idk why my rank is low

Hi Wintercurse. This isn't the thread to be asking questions like that in. If you'd like to come over and make a post on the Rogue Forums, I'll be glad to have a look and try to help you improve

[Wintercurse 0]

2 minutes ago, Carrn said:

Hi Wintercurse. This isn't the thread to be asking questions like that in. If you'd like to come over and make a post on the Rogue Forums, I'll be glad to have a look and try to help you improve

did it,   https://www.icy-veins.com/forums/topic/26998-need-help-to-improve-dps/

 

[Guest Maive]

I'm sorry if this question has already been asked; I don't want to sift through 12 pages of comments.

If you have, say, 7 seconds left on a Nightstalker-buffed Rupture, and you refresh with a 6 combo point unbuffed Rupture, will the 7 seconds that carry over to the new Rupture still be Nightstalker-buffed?

Vice-versa, if you have 7 seconds left on an unbuffed Rupture, and you refresh with a 6 combo point Nightstalker-buffed Rupture, will the 7 seconds that carry over remain unbuffed, or will they inherit the Nightstalker buff that you refreshed with? 

[Furty 51]

51 minutes ago, Guest Maive said:

I'm sorry if this question has already been asked; I don't want to sift through 12 pages of comments.

If you have, say, 7 seconds left on a Nightstalker-buffed Rupture, and you refresh with a 6 combo point unbuffed Rupture, will the 7 seconds that carry over to the new Rupture still be Nightstalker-buffed?

Vice-versa, if you have 7 seconds left on an unbuffed Rupture, and you refresh with a 6 combo point Nightstalker-buffed Rupture, will the 7 seconds that carry over remain unbuffed, or will they inherit the Nightstalker buff that you refreshed with? 

If you refresh with Vanish->Rupture the entire Rupture will bear the Nightstalker bonus — this is why we cast the preliminary Rupture in the opener, allowing our Nightstalker Rupture to get a full pandemic buffed duration. This doesn't work in reverse, however; once you overwrite the existing buffed Rupture the bonus is gone. This works identically to the old "snapshotting" mechanic that all DoTs obeyed in the pre-WoD era of the game.

[Guest Whispyr-Gorefiend]

Okay. I see some issues between top rogue logs and this, especially when using exsanguinate and elaborate planning. It might be weirdly worded or not explicitly stated, however when looking at the casting of vanish, you can see that most top rogues always sit on the buff for exsanguinate. The guide itself states that 6cp vanish ruptures should be done on cooldown. Haven't checked the numbers on this, but I'm going to make an educated guess that with 3 vendetta relics, waiting for vanish vendetta rupture exsanguinates could be a dps increase compared to using everything as it comes up and wasting 15-20 seconds of possible high, opener-esque burst. Thank you for adding the 3 vendetta relic into the relic section. My last problem is with the wording of combo point use. If blizzard hasn't changed the math since the last time I checked, envenom is a linear scaling with combo points. This means a 1cp envenom is as damage efficient per combo point as a 6cp envenom. What that shows to me is that we should be using envenom WITH ANY AMOUNT of combo points in order to maintain as high of an uptime on elaborate planning as possible. Kingsbane could see us having to use 3+ points per envenom in order to ramp the damage and have a 100% uptime during kingsbane burst windows. 

 

On a side note, can anyone confirm the death of agonizing poison as a viable build after 7.1.5's stat rebalance? The damage tuning to rupture (making it equal or linear on a combo point to damage meter, not taking time into account, I can't remember), the pseudo stat "squish" to Substats (big one here would be mastery, as well as an increase to attack power through agility buffs (the main source of rupture damage). I feel like that would make exsanguinate pull ahead of agonizing in all situations. Again, I have yet to crunch numbers and run simulations a million times to confirm it, but I think agonizing might be unobtainable as a viable build before buffs or stronger gear.

[Carrn 284]

1 hour ago, Guest Whispyr-Gorefiend said:

On a side note, can anyone confirm the death of agonizing poison as a viable build after 7.1.5's stat rebalance? The damage tuning to rupture (making it equal or linear on a combo point to damage meter, not taking time into account, I can't remember), the pseudo stat "squish" to Substats (big one here would be mastery, as well as an increase to attack power through agility buffs (the main source of rupture damage). I feel like that would make exsanguinate pull ahead of agonizing in all situations. Again, I have yet to crunch numbers and run simulations a million times to confirm it, but I think agonizing might be unobtainable as a viable build before buffs or stronger gear.

Exsang is actually getting a significant nerf come 7.1.5

1 hour ago, Guest Whispyr-Gorefiend said:

What that shows to me is that we should be using envenom WITH ANY AMOUNT of combo points in order to maintain as high of an uptime on elaborate planning as possible. Kingsbane could see us having to use 3+ points per envenom in order to ramp the damage and have a 100% uptime during kingsbane burst windows. 

Assuming that a person has proper stats, they should have enough Crit to maintain 5-6 cp for every finisher and not need to worry about it too much. If this person gets sort of screwed by RNG, 4CP is probably the minimum they'll have.

Remember that the duration of the Envenom buff is affected by the CPs spent on the skill, and the Energy spent on the skill doesn't change based on the CP spent. Envenom will always cost 35 Energy, whether you spend 1CP or 6CP, meaning that the damage dealt per Energy spent is significantly higher with a 6CP cast than a 1CP one. 

This is part of the reason that Energy management is important. You don't always want to spend Energy as soon as it is available, you spend it at the right time so you always have some available

[Guest Whispyr-Gorefiend]

On ‎12‎/‎26‎/‎2016 at 6:05 AM, Carrn said:

Exsang is actually getting a significant nerf come 7.1.5

From what I read from ptr notes, exsang nerfs have been reverted back to 100%, do you have a link that shows the current nerf?

[Valks 2,375]

20 hours ago, Guest Whispyr-Gorefiend said:

From what I read from ptr notes, exsang nerfs have been reverted back to 100%, do you have a link that shows the current nerf?

It might be that a change has been reverted since Furty's post, given that it was on the 26th.

[Carrn 284]

21 hours ago, Guest Whispyr-Gorefiend said:

From what I read from ptr notes, exsang nerfs have been reverted back to 100%, do you have a link that shows the current nerf?

It's entirely possible. I looked at them when they came out, but after exams and the holidays I lost track of what was live and what was removed.

I'll be back in a little over a week and can start looking at / testing stuff again - assuming that 7.1.5 doesn't go live by then lol

[Valks 2,375]

On 1/3/2017 at 3:48 PM, Carrn said:

I'll be back in a little over a week and can start looking at / testing stuff again - assuming that 7.1.5 doesn't go live by then lol

As long as you're back before "soon", you'll be OK. 

On topic, I believe the poster is correct and they have been reverted.

[Tuinkabouter 0]

I've just hit lvl 110 after a few years of no WoW. But anyway, I see the guide mention assassination has low AoE damage. However, with Poison Knives, it seems like FoK -> Rupture -> tab -> repeat, gives insane AoE damage on mobs that are alive a little longer (without really caring how much combo points you have for rupture), after like 3 or 4 different ruptured mobs you basically have infinite energy. Is that terrible play or are AoE packs simply not alive long enough? Or is it bad to take Poison Knives in the first place?

Edited January 4, 2017 by Tuinkabouter