Need some advise - Tanking

[Guest]

I in no way want to make anyone's dungeon or raid day any worse, but I been thinking about learning to tank. I've already done some on a Blood DK, and Draenei Paladin, but i'm thinking of going Vengeance? What is everyone's opinion on this. I'm trying to decide who and what to main for Legion. I'm not looking for a guide, but just some stories of fellow players already in the space. Thanks.

[Valks 2,375]

Look at it this way: everyone starts somewhere.

My advice would be to level up as a tank in Legion, so that you become comfortable with the Vengeance spells, rotation and what sort of damage you can/can't take.

You don't need to be super fast, chain pulling and storming through dungeons. I guarantee that people would rather see you pull slightly slower and survive the pull, rather than wiping the group. 

Queuing up with friends for dungeons is always a plus, since you won't have to deal with any flamers etc., but you do eventually need to venture into those PUGs. 

I used to tank, for 10 years or so actually, and I recently swapped to healer since I was really bored. I was scared of healing, mainly due to the fact that I was thrown straight into it with Mythic HFC 2-healing. You might hit a few bumps along the way, but you'll find your stride soon enough. If you make a mistake, own up to it and make sure you don't forget it. It might seem weird thinking about your mistakes all the time, but it will force you to improve. 

If you're embarrassed about losing aggro and someone dying, forgetting to pop a cooldown, whatever. It happens, remember your mistake, work on it and push on. 

[Lockybalboa 618]

DH tanking is very strong in 5man content, heroic, mythic, and mythic+. The amount of AoE, CC, and tools veng has really is perfect for that kind of content, however it isn't amazing in raids. Most CC abilities are not as helpful in raid content and the larger massive hits that are associated with it are one of DH's weak areas. That said, unless you are trying to do mid-high level mythic progression then Veng will do just fine in raid settings.

 

As for being a new tank, it isn't as hard as people make it look - at least for most content. Bad tanks get blamed more than they should a lot of times because of how easy it is for a raid to see when a tank screws up. When DPS screw up, unless it wipes the raid, no one or very few people see it. The same for a healer, unless they literally wipe the raid most people don't see when a healer screws up. Tanks on the other hand, even a minor mistake is going to be seen by the entire raid. Thus, instead of being able to blend in with the noise, tanks are often the focus of more anger than they really deserve.

#1 way to NOT piss people off in content, TELL THEM YOU'RE A NEW TANK. When people know that the tank is learning, they are normally a lot more forgiving and a lot more helpful.

[Erelaun 1]

Also try to run some mythic dungeons. That’s a easy way to get a feeling for tanking. Also that’s a good way to try different tank classes. Well at least if you have them high enough. Of course you’ve to keep in mind, that the demon hunter lacks a lot of his talents now which makes him (in my opinion) a little squishy (I’m looking at you 5 Mob pack in Auchindoun which stomped me 3 times in the ground..).  

 

If you can, grab some guild mates and do it with them.

[demonardvark 556]

16 hours ago, Lockybalboa said:

#1 way to NOT piss people off in content, TELL THEM YOU'RE A NEW TANK. When people know that the tank is learning, they are normally a lot more forgiving and a lot more helpful.

^ This. I've jumped between tanking and not tanking. It's an important role but unfortunately people can be a bit... unforgiving. One big thing that I didn't realize is there is a difference between dungeon tanking and raid tanking. Dungeon obviously you are sort of the star, Raid though you share the load with another tank. This typically just means swapping time on the boss, let it beat you up for a bit, then the other guy takes over, rinse and repeat. However, bad off tanks can make things terrible, especially when in a pug. I was in a pug that was like a small family raid group and the off tank was awful, didn't taunt, didn't do his responsibilities, yet I got blamed for everything. I ended up having to solo tank the boss, got to 14 stacks of the debuff, then the raid was saying I sucked and kicked me. So you can get a lot of flack.

That being said though, its a fun role to play. Especially in any content warning people that you are new always helps. I say it everytime even though i've been tanking for years XD. Just remember when people start to complain there is a failure list to refer to.

Did the tank Die? - Healers fault

Did the healer die? - Tanks Fault

Did the dps die? - Their own fault, stop standing in the fire idiot.

[Namuria 2]

As tank it is important to know the content with each boss in it. So you have to look for some guides, or ask people for information.

One of the most important things is to give your group- or raid-members the best position. most of the time you have to turn the boss with his back to your group, it will protect them from attacks. it also mean to walk with the boss out of fire or whatever. and muuuuuch more. :)

all this and more you'll learn while you're playing as tank.

[Lockybalboa 618]

1 hour ago, Namuria said:

As tank it is important to know the content with each boss in it.

...it also mean to walk with the boss out of fire or whatever. and muuuuuch more. :)

all this and more you'll learn while you're playing as tank.

This is why tanks with exp under their belts are far better than other tanks. 90% of the tank mechanics in the game are not new, thus a tank that is in their 4th xpack and 10th tier is going to walk in cold to brand new fights already knowing 95% of any possible mechanic in the fight.

 

...this is also why you will get yelled at when you're new and don't tell anyone. It is kind of odd but people tend to just assume that all tanks are vanilla players that have mained that tank class since MC.

[Erelaun 1]

24 minutes ago, Lockybalboa said:

This is why tanks with exp under their belts are far better than other tanks. 90% of the tank mechanics in the game are not new, thus a tank that is in their 4th xpack and 10th tier is going to walk in cold to brand new fights already knowing 95% of any possible mechanic in the fight.

This! Honestly I even don’t try to remember everything what the boss can do. I just react if it happens. The only thing I memorize is at which amount of stacks I’ve to spot or yell for a spot if my tanking buddy sleeps. I play tank since BC (was healer in classic). So I’ve seen most of the boss mechanics that are around. And I doubt they will add brand new mechanics. I mean most bosses pretty much sum up something like this: Stepp out of the fire (or water, wind whatever), interrupt casts, spot if other tank has x debuffs).

 

But still I read a guide before engaging a new boss (if there are already some around, but since I’m not going for server firsts anymore thats the case most of the time ;) ). And especially a new Tank should find guides useful to get a feeling about what the boss is going to do

[Bonse 2]

Take a look at the basic tanking guide the site has.  It lays out the principles and things you should incorporate into your play.  Then take a look at the spec guide and play around in your tank spec in the open world.  See what spells help you when and when you have a good feel for the spec and your set up, move into 5-man dungeons.  Like has been said in previous posts, LET PEOPLE KNOW YOU'RE NEW TO TANKING!  Generally people let you do your thing and don't try to uber everything.  Granted we are at the end of an expac and quite a bit of the DPS classes put out ridiculous damage so heroic 5-mans may not feel difficult.  Get some experience in 5-man heroics and quest through Legion and you should be set in the 5-man dungeons.  If you are looking at raiding, always take a look at boss guides/videos for tanking.  When I was tanking through the last three expacs they really helped me. 

[TeamC 6]

One of the more important traits of a solid tank is situational awareness. Work to position your camera/yourself and the mob(s) you are tanking in a way that allows you to see as much of the encounter as you can. Learn where adds spawn, where patrols come from, where the next pack of trash is. The more you can see the easier it will be to react to when the Hunter inevitably pulls it with Barrage (and probably doesn't have the intelligence to sync it with a Misdirection to you). If you go into the random dungeon finder people will naturally look to you to set an acceptable pace, know what to pull, what to skip, and generally be able to quickly adapt to whatever comes your way. Luckily you have the tools to do just that, because people can and will put your ability to save them from themselves to the test.

Pay close attention to the "rotation" enemies have in their abilities. Deadly Boss Mods will make sure you're aware of the important things, but you can help yourself along by knowing when spikes in damage are coming and saving CDs to use accordingly. Proper use of defensive CDs and abilities can be worth more than 30 item levels in terms of staying alive. To go along with this, set up your UI so you can see the duration of your defense CDs, so you know when you have to re-apply Demon Spikes or whatever it is for whichever class you end up tanking on. 

Also, think ahead and think of the worst case scenarios. Look at your abilities and figure out how you can use them to best effect in those scenarios. If the Hunter stupidly pulls the next pack of trash, how do you pull them off? What happens if the ability you wanted to use first is on CD? What else can work? What abilities do you have to help mitigate the damage when your pull goes from 4 to 8? Can you get by with a minor CD? Do you have to go to the big CD instead? What happens if it's not up, what can you use to CC or otherwise mitigate incoming damage? The more you know about what your abilities are and how they interact with both each other and with mobs, the better off you'll be.

This sounds like a lot to take in at once, but it's stuff you will learn with practice. Don't think you have to know everything there is to know the first time you tank something, but definitely keep learning as you go.

And as people have said above, be vocal with people. Say hey I'm learning to tank, bear with me. If they give you any crap for being a noob, do your best to ignore them. Most people will just be happy their queue popped and they'll do what they can to get through the dungeon. The better ones will do what they can to help you out.

If possible, I'd advise running with friends/guildies first. They'll understand what you're trying to do and hopefully be less obnoxious in the learning process.

[Bonse 2]

12 hours ago, TeamC said:

One of the more important traits of a solid tank is situational awareness. Work to position your camera/yourself and the mob(s) you are tanking in a way that allows you to see as much of the encounter as you can. Learn where adds spawn, where patrols come from, where the next pack of trash is. The more you can see the easier it will be to react to when the Hunter inevitably pulls it with Barrage (and probably doesn't have the intelligence to sync it with a Misdirection to you). If you go into the random dungeon finder people will naturally look to you to set an acceptable pace, know what to pull, what to skip, and generally be able to quickly adapt to whatever comes your way. Luckily you have the tools to do just that, because people can and will put your ability to save them from themselves to the test.

 

Guilty as charged with the Barrage, but I do Misdirect to the tank when there is the possibility of pulling additional mobs.  Most do not do that though; I get annoyed when others do it while I am on my tank, but it forced me to learn when to panic and hit my big CDs and when not to. 

[TeamC 6]

11 hours ago, Bonse said:

Guilty as charged with the Barrage, but I do Misdirect to the tank when there is the possibility of pulling additional mobs.  Most do not do that though; I get annoyed when others do it while I am on my tank, but it forced me to learn when to panic and hit my big CDs and when not to. 

Kudos to you for starting to sync it! It's not the end of the world if it happens, it can just be problematic, particularly in more difficult content. At this point I consider it an occupational hazard and sit on abilities accordingly. I just wish Blizzard could get that ability under control so it was still worth taking but wasn't just the "problem" it often seems to be. 

[Bonse 2]

11 hours ago, TeamC said:

Kudos to you for starting to sync it! It's not the end of the world if it happens, it can just be problematic, particularly in more difficult content. At this point I consider it an occupational hazard and sit on abilities accordingly. I just wish Blizzard could get that ability under control so it was still worth taking but wasn't just the "problem" it often seems to be. 

I feel that Barrage is more trouble than what the damage is worth.  If I constantly have to second guess myself to see if I'm going to pull additional groups or spend the time repositioning to use it I waste valuable time and damage.  I know what the guides say and the difference in my damage done, but it is frustrating.  Yes, I should have the presence of mind to position myself beforehand, but that is just too much effort when I am running stuff just to run stuff.  When Legion hits in a week and if I decide to main my hunt(ard) then maybe I will use Barrage in leveling, gearing up, and in progression, but Crows is a heck of a lot easier to use.  I am not really a fan of what they with the changes, but anyways back to tanking.... 

Something else to look at with deciding what to tank as, is how your damage comes in and what the healers will do to keep you up.  Pallys have a smooth and fairly predictable damage intake where DKs are a bit choppy and force some healers to freak out if the DK is slow or does not quite understand the spec.  I have yet to tank as a DH or heal them so I do not know how they fare.