Frost DK - Does it do anything well?

[Alexizonfire 7]

36 minutes ago, Browed said:

I don't think you're doing much wrong on the face of it, certainly the numbers on Nyth for single target with 2 x rots is very good.

Looking at armory in blood spec and judging by your ilvl in bags do you run with a Legendary in Frost.. if so.. which one?

Only comment for me, is that I'd run Obliteration with Frostscythe especially for the burst fights like Eleth but it's a very minor change.

For that fight and in general I'd only go with Icecap if you have the Leg. Bracers, hence my question on armory ;)

I'm only at testing stage for that setup myself at the moment as I've just got the bracers in the last couple of days.

No legendaries, and the talent build i was using was 

It/fp/ava/winter/whitewalker/ra/oblit

I only used scythe on elerethe yesterday (helping them out again) thinking it'd do better because of aoe, but i felt underwhelming... i ended the fight with like me, the mt and 2 other people alive burning the boss from like 8% to 0, i was spamming DS to stay alive.

As you can imagine there was no downing cenarius with these guys so it  was a wipe fest.

[demonardvark 556]

it seems now the general ideal going around is <30% crit use obliterate >30% crit use scythe

[Browed 19]

Agreed on the group issue, you can get some wild differences:

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/rankings/character/14376590/latest/#boss=0

Notice the comparison between the LFR and Normal runs there... granted the switch between Legendaries too but both AoE (mythic centric) builds.

Both PUGs were very very poor, so spending half your time chasing a boss or spinning is quite a dps killer, which again highlights that your logs are not bad at all.

[Alexizonfire 7]

8 minutes ago, demonardvark said:

it seems now the general ideal going around is <30% crit use obliterate >30% crit use scythe

Cmon ard, notice me senpai! Waiting on your feedback pn these logs Xp

 

3 minutes ago, Browed said:

Agreed on the group issue, you can get some wild differences:

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/rankings/character/14376590/latest/#boss=0

Notice the comparison between the LFR and Normal runs there... granted the switch between Legendaries too but both AoE (mythic centric) builds.

Both PUGs were very very poor, so spending half your time chasing a boss or spinning is quite a dps killer, which again highlights that your logs are not bad at all.

Yea you're right it's pretty heartwarming... It makes me hopeful for when i can actually constantly flask and pre old war/old war every fight, and even moreso when i finally get a goddamned leg!

[demonardvark 556]

3 hours ago, Alexizonfire said:

Cmon ard, notice me senpai! Waiting on your feedback pn these logs Xp

YOUR LOGS ARE BAD AND YOU SHOULD FEEL BAD!!!!

no, didn't see that you updated your post :)

Looking at things rotationally I don't see anything that concerns me. The only thing I am noticing is your stats and talent choice. With the amount of crit and mastery you have, you may want to think about playing with ice cap more. Simply because avalanche is only 1% of your dps now on most fights, and Ice cap can give you a lot more pillar of frost uptime. Also just a general heads up, your stats are really getting close to the threshold where you may want to start looking at frost scythe, obliteration is a great pairing for it (mandatory cough) so its good that you are already using obliteration. I saw on eleth you went with glacial/Fsc, when taking FsC period you really want obliteration, but also for creepy tree FsC is good even below ideal gear levels for it in order to pad meters er uhhhhh have really good cleave on bloods.

So in general you are doing quite well, just some talent changes here and there. Another thing that will give you large gains would be different trinkets. However, everything being said, doing this well with the trinkets you have, you will likely destroy meters once you get some stronger ones :)

tldr ya do gud

[Alexizonfire 7]

On 14/10/2016 at 10:48 AM, demonardvark said:

YOUR LOGS ARE BAD AND YOU SHOULD FEEL BAD!!!!

no, didn't see that you updated your post :)

Looking at things rotationally I don't see anything that concerns me. The only thing I am noticing is your stats and talent choice. With the amount of crit and mastery you have, you may want to think about playing with ice cap more. Simply because avalanche is only 1% of your dps now on most fights, and Ice cap can give you a lot more pillar of frost uptime. Also just a general heads up, your stats are really getting close to the threshold where you may want to start looking at frost scythe, obliteration is a great pairing for it (mandatory cough) so its good that you are already using obliteration. I saw on eleth you went with glacial/Fsc, when taking FsC period you really want obliteration, but also for creepy tree FsC is good even below ideal gear levels for it in order to pad meters er uhhhhh have really good cleave on bloods.

So in general you are doing quite well, just some talent changes here and there. Another thing that will give you large gains would be different trinkets. However, everything being said, doing this well with the trinkets you have, you will likely destroy meters once you get some stronger ones :)

tldr ya do gud

Ik, i've been relentlessly running vault but man faulty simply refuses to drop. I get giggles when i get declined from grps despite averaging a 500k overall dps at the end of my runs (fscythe build ofc)

I was an advocate of Zefyrk's build but after seeing Phenom's logs i am conflicted. His performance on mythic commands respect. I might just have to go Mg all the way. I also noted he was using Ga over obliteration. 

[demonardvark 556]

1 hour ago, Alexizonfire said:

Ik, i've been relentlessly running vault but man faulty simply refuses to drop. I get giggles when i get declined from grps despite averaging a 500k overall dps at the end of my runs (fscythe build ofc)

I was an advocate of Zefyrk's build but after seeing Phenom's logs i am conflicted. His performance on mythic commands respect. I might just have to go Mg all the way. I also noted he was using Ga over obliteration. 

Ga is being favored by a lot of people because it scales with mastery and quite well. It also fills a gap for a single rune if you don't have Km up for FsC usage or even to continue FP uptime while using obliterate. Obliteration is just nice because it gives you 4 guaranteed crit frostscythes on command, in addition you can stack it with pillar and 5 stacks of razorice for some huge damage.  As much as I favored RA i have to admit FsC is winning me over. I'm almost to the point where 2 non crit FsCs are better than 1 obliterate, so, a bit more stats and I think i'll end up full FsC spam and eschew obliterate entirerly. I thought it wouldn't be until nighthold until it was possible to reach that threshold but I think now almost as early as Heroic EN it can be possible. 

[Alexizonfire 7]

5 minutes ago, demonardvark said:

Ga is being favored by a lot of people because it scales with mastery and quite well. It also fills a gap for a single rune if you don't have Km up for FsC usage or even to continue FP uptime while using obliterate. Obliteration is just nice because it gives you 4 guaranteed crit frostscythes on command, in addition you can stack it with pillar and 5 stacks of razorice for some huge damage.  As much as I favored RA i have to admit FsC is winning me over. I'm almost to the point where 2 non crit FsCs are better than 1 obliterate, so, a bit more stats and I think i'll end up full FsC spam and eschew obliterate entirerly. I thought it wouldn't be until nighthold until it was possible to reach that threshold but I think now almost as early as Heroic EN it can be possible. 

I find obliteration awkward with mg as i personally struggle getting enough rp to keep IT going let alone spamming it 4 times in a row.

Maybe im doing something wrong.

A legendary would be nice too. It's frankly irritating that i have yet to get one. 

[demonardvark 556]

49 minutes ago, Alexizonfire said:

I find obliteration awkward with mg as i personally struggle getting enough rp to keep IT going let alone spamming it 4 times in a row.

Maybe im doing something wrong.

A legendary would be nice too. It's frankly irritating that i have yet to get one. 

you only need about 50ish rp because FsC generates some RP on its own as well. it just takes a little playing with. 

the legendaries have me a bit nervous. its hard to decide which loot spec to sit in. unholy has some nice ones but frost really only has one that is super powerful, so it certainly is the one im shopping for but i have bad luck with things like that XD

[Alexizonfire 7]

7 minutes ago, demonardvark said:

you only need about 50ish rp because FsC generates some RP on its own as well. it just takes a little playing with. 

the legendaries have me a bit nervous. its hard to decide which loot spec to sit in. unholy has some nice ones but frost really only has one that is super powerful, so it certainly is the one im shopping for but i have bad luck with things like that XD

That really isn't an option for me as i have no intentions of playing UH.

Alright, i guess we'll see how everything works tonight, i'll log everything and see how i manage with mg.

[demonardvark 556]

3 hours ago, Alexizonfire said:

That really isn't an option for me as i have no intentions of playing UH.

Alright, i guess we'll see how everything works tonight, i'll log everything and see how i manage with mg.

i'll be waiting to cruelly judge them and say mean things on the internet because i am blocked by the shield of anonymity er i mean, uh, give helpful feedback :D

[Alexizonfire 7]

23 hours ago, demonardvark said:

i'll be waiting to cruelly judge them and say mean things on the internet because i am blocked by the shield of anonymity er i mean, uh, give helpful feedback :D

Sadly i have no logs for you... But i have something much better! Listen to this.

So i was doing my suramar emissary quests yestetday, when i entered withered training to get my cache&stuff you know. So i go blood as usual bc leystalker will bitchslap your ass all over town otherwise as im sure you know. So everything is fine and dandy and i ace the place, so i open up my chests, nothing worth mentioning so i go turn in for the cache and open it and BOOM! Legendary belt!

Im so happy and excited, then i take a look at my prize only to realize loot spec somehow reset itself on current spec as im looking at the blood legendary belt. I think i died a little bit inside. And ofc blizz said too bad so sad deal with it nerd lul.

Oh and we had to pug a bunch of people for raid night and after our third wipe on ursoc we just bailed. All in all a horrible night.

Oh and those new buffs on ptr look sexy, what do you think?

[demonardvark 556]

33 minutes ago, Alexizonfire said:

Sadly i have no logs for you... But i have something much better! Listen to this.

So i was doing my suramar emissary quests yestetday, when i entered withered training to get my cache&stuff you know. So i go blood as usual bc leystalker will bitchslap your ass all over town otherwise as im sure you know. So everything is fine and dandy and i ace the place, so i open up my chests, nothing worth mentioning so i go turn in for the cache and open it and BOOM! Legendary belt!

Im so happy and excited, then i take a look at my prize only to realize loot spec somehow reset itself on current spec as im looking at the blood legendary belt. I think i died a little bit inside. And ofc blizz said too bad so sad deal with it nerd lul.

Oh and we had to pug a bunch of people for raid night and after our third wipe on ursoc we just bailed. All in all a horrible night.

Oh and those new buffs on ptr look sexy, what do you think?

one, that build is actually amazing for blood defense so i am a bit jelly

the unholy buffs are too weak and insufficient, the frost buff is nice but its a bandaid not a fix. with the new value of obliterate, the OBRA rotation will be competitive much longer however eventually frostscythe will still overtake it, obliterate still doesn't scale at all they just hard buffed it. so it likely won't be in nighthold now it will be in tomb of sargeras or whatever the next raid after is, if not further on, however, FsC will still eventually take over. The howling blast buff is okay. So, they are nice buffs, and will move frost from dead last dps somewhere likely lower middle of the pack, however, long term the spec is far from fixed, we still have a lot of issues, its just a good bandaid until they come up with real solutions. so, they are nice initial buffs but we need mechanical changes just not number buffs. 

tldr buffs are nice but problem isn't fixed, like in bad relationship and they bring you flowers, yay flowers, but we still got probs.

[Alexizonfire 7]

8 minutes ago, demonardvark said:

one, that build is actually amazing for blood defense so i am a bit jelly

the unholy buffs are too weak and insufficient, the frost buff is nice but its a bandaid not a fix. with the new value of obliterate, the OBRA rotation will be competitive much longer however eventually frostscythe will still overtake it, obliterate still doesn't scale at all they just hard buffed it. so it likely won't be in nighthold now it will be in tomb of sargeras or whatever the next raid after is, if not further on, however, FsC will still eventually take over. The howling blast buff is okay. So, they are nice buffs, and will move frost from dead last dps somewhere likely lower middle of the pack, however, long term the spec is far from fixed, we still have a lot of issues, its just a good bandaid until they come up with real solutions. so, they are nice initial buffs but we need mechanical changes just not number buffs. 

tldr buffs are nice but problem isn't fixed, like in bad relationship and they bring you flowers, yay flowers, but we still got probs.

5% more frost dmg is quite good imo. Add to that buffed HB base dmg, increased by rime furthermore. I know it doesn't fix KM or oblit, but we'll be good for a little while i think. 

[demonardvark 556]

16 hours ago, Alexizonfire said:

5% more frost dmg is quite good imo. Add to that buffed HB base dmg, increased by rime furthermore. I know it doesn't fix KM or oblit, but we'll be good for a little while i think. 

Its honestly the same song and dance we've had since cataclysm. Obliterate never scaled properly and it led to alternate playstyles. MoP saw masterfrost, WoD saw howling blast spam. Despite trinket choice 2H frost was lowest dps (yes below survival) end of WoD due to scaling issues. So, OBRA will be better for pure single target fights however anything with cleave FsC usage will be superior. Eventually and its more long term now certainly, eventually machinegun will dominate.

So, I have mixed feelings about it. Frost always had a mixed identity with the two weapon choices and I see the history of dichotomy remains now with talent choices. Frostscythe is appealing aesthetically and its nice to have additional cleave. However, I always preferred the obliterate focused builds, i liked the slower big hit feeling. The issue now with frost though is every percentage into a stat can heavily augment which talent build is best for you. So, its hazier than ever. 

I think at this point, I'd like to see BoS buffed further, and have a strong BoS rotation be viable. Never thought I'd say it, but I kind of miss BoS XD

[Alexizonfire 7]

2 hours ago, demonardvark said:

Its honestly the same song and dance we've had since cataclysm. Obliterate never scaled properly and it led to alternate playstyles. MoP saw masterfrost, WoD saw howling blast spam. Despite trinket choice 2H frost was lowest dps (yes below survival) end of WoD due to scaling issues. So, OBRA will be better for pure single target fights however anything with cleave FsC usage will be superior. Eventually and its more long term now certainly, eventually machinegun will dominate.

So, I have mixed feelings about it. Frost always had a mixed identity with the two weapon choices and I see the history of dichotomy remains now with talent choices. Frostscythe is appealing aesthetically and its nice to have additional cleave. However, I always preferred the obliterate focused builds, i liked the slower big hit feeling. The issue now with frost though is every percentage into a stat can heavily augment which talent build is best for you. So, its hazier than ever. 

I think at this point, I'd like to see BoS buffed further, and have a strong BoS rotation be viable. Never thought I'd say it, but I kind of miss BoS XD

Yes i if elongated breath build could be viable i'd love it. It's the most original and fun build i've seen yet but it's completely unreliable right now. Well, now that i think of it, with the upcoming buffs, the legendary frost belt, wrist, helm or ring and the set bonus im thinking we might be able to sustain breath for as long as its cd, provided you dont have to move too much. And you could pair this with RW talent too, im excited to try it out.