Looking for some frost help

[Deathniight 0]

Have been messing around with frost the past few days, and find it pretty enjoyable. The most fun I have playing it is playing the machine gun rotation with frostscythe. The guide is just a little unclear in areas and I want to make sure I do it right and most efficiently. The rotation in the guide makes rime procs high up on the list, but never mentions to use obliterate not even once. Which then leads me to my second question and that's on ST, like bosses, do I still spam frostscythe or should I be using obliterate even with the rotation?

[Xanatos 0]

Honestly I think its you use obliterate if you have like, 2 runes left, just to trigger a chance at a rime proc.

[Valks 2,375]

I suck at Frost, so I can't help much, but going to tag @Zefyrk, since he recently posted some fairly impressive frost logs. Perhaps he can help. If not, resident genius @demonardvark will save the day!

[demonardvark 556]

Zefryk ultimately uses a slightly augmented version of the machine gun rotation, emulating him does lead to much higher results. That being said he does not take frostscythe at all, he instead uses runic atten. So, from that, he gets the rime procs from obliterate as expected. Plus, obliterate actually favors the machine rotation more, that's because in one GCD you are burning 2 runes instead of one, this leads to higher frozen pulse uptimes. In addition, it feeds more runic power, in the practical machine gun rotation you end up casting frost strike quite a bit, so that extra RP is good.

What i've been playing with in addition, is forsaking the fallen crusader enchant completely for double razor ice enchants, This leads to more super charged shattering strikes and with frost strike being the number one source of damage it augments our highest damage source at no rotational change. Still playing with it though to see if the frequent 40% stronger frost strikes are in fact better than the fallen crusader window buff.

For single target at least right now, frostscythe is still sort of undertuned, so, I don't really touch it at all. It's base damage is only 120% weapon damage versus obliterates 640%. So, even with 2 frostscythes you are still doing less damage than obliterate. Now, it does do 4 times damage on KM bringing it up to 480% but its still inferior to obliterate. Now 2 km powered ones will overtake obliterate but you need to have the procs for that to play out. Now, as the xpac progresses, Obliterate will scale like crap, it always does and the way the damage is currently done, its going to scale poorly. So, later in the xpac frostscythe will completely overtake it, however, for now, unless you have really high haste and have a pretty constant km frequency, I'd recommend obliterate for machine gun. 

[Browed 19]

I've managed to log some limited data on my high mastery build (40%)

On a log for Lady Hatecoil (mixture of single and multi target)

I separated out the crits for FS, Oblit and FScy

Interestingly we get average crits for each:

Oblit: 113k

FS: 230k

FScy: 260k

Now, bear in mind the mainhand/offhand factor, so Oblit will be averaging close to 200k in that run too.

I think this shows the vastly different scaling for frost abilities with this level of mastery, I'm not massively ahead of anyone on the meters because of my low crit and therefore lower proc on KM, but I'm gradually improving this and will post more data as I collect it.

[demonardvark 556]

1 hour ago, Browed said:

I've managed to log some limited data on my high mastery build (40%)

On a log for Lady Hatecoil (mixture of single and multi target)

I separated out the crits for FS, Oblit and FScy

Interestingly we get average crits for each:

Oblit: 113k

FS: 230k

FScy: 260k

Now, bear in mind the mainhand/offhand factor, so Oblit will be averaging close to 200k in that run too.

I think this shows the vastly different scaling for frost abilities with this level of mastery, I'm not massively ahead of anyone on the meters because of my low crit and therefore lower proc on KM, but I'm gradually improving this and will post more data as I collect it.

Correct because Obliterate........ doesn't scale XD. (it does just poorly), so as we get higher and higher mastery frostscythe becomes more much stronger.