Subpar Sub DPS

[GeneralA 0]

Hi,

I really like the subtlety playing style but unfortunately I seem to be doing something wrong. I'm now Ilevel 845 and from reading around a bit I should be able to sustain 200k+ dps. Unfortunately I'm having a hard time reaching even 180k on a dummy. And with everything that happens in a raid that'll be even worse. I did an 8min session on a raid dummy in org. 

 

Armory: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/defias-brotherhood/Shadowbearer/simple

Logs: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/Y4dTX1grAw69HcJC/#fight=3&type=damage-done&source=13

It'd be highly appreciated if any of you has some pointers.

I should note that I started my ap path wrong and now only got finality and not akaari's soul.

Thanks

[GeneralA 0]

Shadowcraft also suggests that I should be able to reach 250k+ dps. I'm probably missing some Pots and buffs that they account for but that should not explain the large gap.

http://shadowcraft.mmo-mumble.com/eu/defias-brotherhood/shadowbearer

Edited October 10, 2016 by GeneralA

[Zer0mir 0]

I could be wrong but I don't see any Akaari's Soul or Finality procs which is a significant part of Sub dps. How many artifact traits have you purchased? If you haven't yet, make a beeline to Akaari's soul and then try to get Finality.

[GeneralA 0]

4 hours ago, Zer0mir said:

I could be wrong but I don't see any Akaari's Soul or Finality procs which is a significant part of Sub dps. How many artifact traits have you purchased? If you haven't yet, make a beeline to Akaari's soul and then try to get Finality.

I do have Finality. It's weird that it doesn't show up on the buffs. I'll most definately go to Akaari's soul from here though.

[Audio88 0]

your problem is definitely pooling energy for shadowdance. On average you're casting 2.2 shadowstrikes per shadowdance. If you're not getting 3 to 4 shadowstrikes every dance you're losing a lot of DPS. You need a 100 energy before you cast dance.

To get 4 shadowstrikes you need to cast a 5 point finisher because it builds energy through relentless strikes, you also need to be chain casting these spells as soon as the GCD is up.  Ideally you cast x2 shadow strikes, Finisher, x2 shadow strikes. 3 Shadowstrikes, finisher, shadowstrike often doens't work if your haste is low. So you will need 1 combo point on the target before you can do the 2-1-2 combo to get a 5 point finisher.  Replace one of the shadowstrikes with symbols when it needs to be refreshed, and you should average around 3 to 3.4 shadow strikes.

The shadowcraft sub model is messed up atm ,  you're not going to be doing 250k dps at 845 ilvl. 

If your artifact is the one i saw in shadowcraft, you desperately need to reset your artifact. It's going to save you in the long run to do the proper icy-veins trait path, which gets 3 gold traits asap. This path your on is going to hurt you until you max out your artifact. If you reset now it'll put you back 40k AP, but you'll get 2 gold traits out of it, and a third gold trait long before you max out your artifact.

[GeneralA 0]

Thanks for the help. I'll definately use your advice for my artifact. Your talking about 5 point finishers. Is this with vigor? I'm running DS at the moment. Or just hit the finisher at 5 cp? 

I'm also seeing evisc not helping a lot on relentless strikes because it takes about as much energy as rs produces.

Will definately try this out.

[Carrn 284]

37 minutes ago, GeneralA said:

Thanks for the help. I'll definately use your advice for my artifact. Your talking about 5 point finishers. Is this with vigor? I'm running DS at the moment. Or just hit the finisher at 5 cp? 

I'm also seeing evisc not helping a lot on relentless strikes because it takes about as much energy as rs produces.

Will definately try this out.

DS is better - using 6CP Evis it's 100% chance for the full amount of Energy + a 20% chance for an additional bunch of Energy

[Audio88 0]

10 hours ago, GeneralA said:

Thanks for the help. I'll definately use your advice for my artifact. Your talking about 5 point finishers. Is this with vigor? I'm running DS at the moment. Or just hit the finisher at 5 cp? 

I'm also seeing evisc not helping a lot on relentless strikes because it takes about as much energy as rs produces.

Will definately try this out.

yea.. it's better to combo dance with a nightblade finisher because it cost 10 less energy.

Edited October 12, 2016 by Audio88

[Carrn 284]

5 hours ago, Audio88 said:

yea.. it's better to combo dance with a nightblade finisher because it cost 10 less energy.

It's really not better or worse.

I get 4 SS in 90% of my Shadow Dances, assuming I pool resources properly. On a 808 item level Rogue too, not one with high levels of gear.

[GeneralA 0]

Reset my artifact today. Missing one point for finality now. Had some more practice on a dummy and realised I have a tendancy to wait for gcd after starting shadow dance. Obviously for no reason at all but it's not easy to lose habbits. 

Will post new results once I have two gold traits. 

How do you guys find this rotation in a dungeon setting? I'm already in need of a lot of practice to get it right on a dummy. In dungeons you also have to keep track of e erything else. It does seem like more of a hassle to run this rotation compared to other specs and classes. 

[Carrn 284]

1 hour ago, GeneralA said:

Reset my artifact today. Missing one point for finality now. Had some more practice on a dummy and realised I have a tendancy to wait for gcd after starting shadow dance. Obviously for no reason at all but it's not easy to lose habbits. 

Will post new results once I have two gold traits. 

How do you guys find this rotation in a dungeon setting? I'm already in need of a lot of practice to get it right on a dummy. In dungeons you also have to keep track of e erything else. It does seem like more of a hassle to run this rotation compared to other specs and classes. 

I actually find it really strong in dungeons - especially with large pulls, using SD to buff SStorm, throwing Nightblades on everything that will live for a while and using Evis on what won't is very useful. If the pulls are 4-5 people, you're probably using SStorm > Finisher repeatedly, which means you aren't even really spending a charge of SD because it's refunded so quickly.

Also, for priority interrupt targets on M+, having SD for free CS stuns on demand is really useful

I think that once that 3rd gold trait is picked up with Second Shuriken, Sub's AoE is going to be incredibly powerful, and I'm planning on continuing to play it in every situation

[Audio88 0]

13 hours ago, Carrn said:

It's really not better or worse.

I get 4 SS in 90% of my Shadow Dances, assuming I pool resources properly. On a 808 item level Rogue too, not one with high levels of gear.

I wasn't implying that 4 shadowstrikes wasn't possible/consistant with eviscerate.

With evis you're waiting on energy, with nightblade everything just goes smoother. You also can't do the 3-1-1 combo with eviscerate.

[Carrn 284]

5 hours ago, Audio88 said:

You also can't do the 3-1-1 combo with eviscerate.

Assuming you mean SSx3 > Evis > SS, yeah you can

It's much easier if you get the 20% chance for the extra refund from RS, but it's possible