5.4 PTR Caster (Warlock specific) Gear Preview

[Zagam 1,982]

I saw a post on MMO-Champ where the Garrosh loot would be bound to your battle.net account.  If this is true, it's going to be pretty crazy with multiple people wanting just about every item for their alts.

[Alphric 7]

I saw a post on MMO-Champ where the Garrosh loot would be bound to your battle.net account.  If this is true, it's going to be pretty crazy with multiple people wanting just about every item for their alts.

I think that's kind of bullshit. If you want gear do the raid on that toon. They might as well make titan runestones boa too.

[Zagam 1,982]

No reason to not like it.  It just makes toon switching easier if need be.  Also would allow a group to filter gear to an alt to help in a different situation without having to literally carry them.  I've always wished you could swap weapons and trinkets around your account.  Achievements, mounts, and everything else is bind-on-account...why not gear?  It's not like they made all gear BoA...just the weapons. 

[Nytemare 2]

Just saw your list - and if I stay destro than gear looks nice as crit not a bad thing for us. But for Demo all the crit is weak - blizz needs to do a better job at itemization part. How do they figure everyone wants crit on ever piece of gear. Affliction/Demo wants Haste/Mastery - they should have gear that matches that spec, gear for Destro/Pyro mages. Instead they just force poor stats on everyone.

Seems if it goes live - T set will be weak for demo due to all the crit. Unless they plan to make Demo want crit now

Edited August 4, 2013 by Nytemare

[Alphric 7]

I agree that crit on gear is untasty because its the lowest priority stat for every warlock spec.

[Zagam 1,982]

We can reforge it.  It's not like it decreases DPS...it's just the least desirable stat...as of now.  Haste is being nerfed by its effects on trinkets, meta helm, and other RPPM effects, so Crit may increase.  Hard to say until new testing is done.

[Alphric 7]

interesting/crazy

[Omaric 246]

I don't see how the change to haste and RPPM trinkets in relation to us is going to change our stat weights.  Hasn't it always been a very minimal increase in uptime anyway?  RNG is RNG?

 

The only reason I can see crit going up now is for Demonology, due to the fact that most people will probably be dropping UVoLS and glyph of EA.  More random crits is great as well as increased damage on Soulfire, which seems to scale nicely.

[Zagam 1,982]

RPPM effects were triple dipping from Haste.  With the gutting that is happening, you're very right in that Crit will become more useful.  It may, in fact, become that Demonology will be heavy on Grim of Service/Supremacy with a Mastery/Crit build instead of Haste.  Since Touch of Chaos only benefits from a lower global with Haste and Soul Fire reaches a pretty quick cast without a heavy Haste build, you may just want Crit because it will always increase Soul Fire damage, increase Wild Imp spawn rate, and give you an overall increase to your DPS. 

 

The only bad thing is if you play a different spec, such as Affliction, you're going to be gimping yourself one way or another.  Crit will never be desirable as Affliction because critical effects do absolutely nothing for anything in Affliction aside from increase damage.  The budget for increasing Crit is much more expensive than Haste or Mastery.  Depending on what they do to Destruction, it may be best to go Destruction/Demonology with a Mastery > Crit > Haste build instead of Demo/Aff with Mastery > Haste > Crit. 

 

Then again, the stats will make a small change, but adapting to the new fights and fight mechanics will determine the best spec and players.

[Omaric 246]

Crit will never be desirable as Affliction because critical effects do absolutely nothing for anything in Affliction aside from increase damage. 

 

If you can get a decent enough crit, the T16 2-piece bonus for Affliction might make crit mildly desirable.

[Zagam 1,982]

Naw.  Here's the math...

 

UA = 14 sec base duration, 2 sec base tick interval.  Let's assume 6637 Haste for +2 ticks (9 ticks) in 14 seconds.  This Haste level is a joke to achieve even at 500 ilvl. 

 

2pc T16 trigger = 50% chance on UA crit.  With only 4k Crit rating, my Warlock sits at 18.xx% base, 23% with Crit buff.  Assuming the low end of 20%, you'd have to be pretty unlucky to not get one single crit at 20% chance with 9 tries. 

 

Statistics

 

p = 0.20 (or whatever your crit chance is) - using a binomial distribution function where N = crits, k = 9, and p=0.20, we see the following:

 

P(0) = 13.4%

P(1) = 30.2%

P(2) = 30.2%

P(3) = 17.6%

 

For fun, here is the chance of not getting a crit at variable crit chance...

 

P(0, 20%) = 13.4%

P(0, 25%) = 7.5%

P(0, 30%) = 4.0%

P(0, 35%) = 2.1%

 

Remember, those values are with just 6637 Haste!  Let's take a look at someone around 550 ilvl with 12439 Haste (+3 ticks).  Now we're talking about 10 chances in 14 seconds.  New probabilities given as such:

 

P(0, 20%) = 10.7%

P(0, 25%) = 5.6%

P(0, 30%) = 2.8%

P(0, 35%) = 1.3%

 

So, you'd have a measly 13.4% chance to not get a single crit with a 20% crit rate for 9 ticks of UA.  You have an astounding 30.2% chance to get exactly 1 crit or exactly 2 crits, meaning you'd have well over a 50% chance to get at least 2 crits in a 9 second window.  With people getting T16 likely being way over 20% crit, you can see the dramatic dropoff of the percent chance to not see a crit.  At 25%, you're now looking at a 92.5% of getting at least one crit in a 14 second window with 9 chances.  With Haste at 12k, you're looking at an tiny 5.6% chance of not getting at least 1 crit in 14 seconds which makes triggering the bonus almost impossible.  Since the trigger effect has a 50% chance, it complicates the formula a bit, but you can see you should reliably see VERY high uptime with a measly crit rating like 20%.  This calculates the % uptime you'd have from ONLY your Agony ticks.  This doesn't include the Agony ticks from MG or DS. 

 

TL;DR: Crit still won't be attractive to Affliction because you'll already reliably see extremely high uptime.  If anyone at Blizz sees this math or does it themselves, I'd expect the effect to decrease to 10 seconds or have the % chance to trigger drop to 25-30%.  At 50% with 20% crit rate and a 15 second duration, it is very obtainable to see 100% uptime of this effect.  Many on the PTR are reporting they have this buff up all the time anyways.

[Zagam 1,982]

Also, does anyone know the duration of the effect for Demonology?  PTR just states 20% chance to increase damage by 20%.  I can estimate uptime of that if I know the duration.

[Omaric 246]

Interesting!!!

 

Edit:  Also, 10 seconds on the Demo 2-piece bonus.

Edited August 5, 2013 by Omaric

[Zagam 1,982]

Hmm...yeah, that seems more reasonable.  20% chance on Soul Fire hit for 10 sec bonus.  This will make Soul Fire a high priority until you get the buff then Touch of Chaos while you have it so you save Molten Core charges to get the buff again.  MC SF base cast = 2.0 sec, so with some Haste, if you spammed it, you'd likely get off 6-7 casts.  This will NOT be at 100% uptime. 

 

(I need to just do the math here then remember to put it in the 5.4 guides when it goes live and set bonuses are stabilized)

 

p = 0.2

time = 10s

(w 5% raid Haste)

20% Haste = 1.587 (6.3 casts/10 sec)

30% Haste = 1.465 (6.8 casts/10 sec)

40% Haste = 1.361 (7.4 casts/10 sec)

 

(w 5% + Bloodlust)

20% Haste = 1.221 (8.2 casts/10 sec)

30% Haste = 1.127 (8.9 casts/10 sec)

40% Haste = 1.047 (9.6 casts/10 sec)

 

Just going to use the 30% Haste formulas (people can calculate based on their own Haste if they want to)

*P(n) = probability of getting n critical hits in 10 seconds

 

30% Haste + 5% Raid Haste

P(0) = 20.98%

P(1) = 36.70%

P(2) = 27.53%

 

30% Haste + 5% Raid Haste + Bloodlust

P(0) = 13.42%

P(1) = 30.20%

P(2) = 30.20%

 

This uptime would be close to 100% if you could spam Soul Fire.  Since we can't do that, you'll optimize uptime by always prioritizing Soul Fire over Touch of Chaos when you have Molten Core charges.  Not sure if weaving ToC in when you get a set bonus proc would be worth it.  It would be a shame to overlap the procs, though.

[Omaric 246]

Man, I don't know.  Everything is going to feel extremely different with our GREATLY decreased DF generation.  I'll start getting used to my Shadowbolt key again.  I feel like our Wild Imps will be cut in half.  Let's see...

 

Last normal Durumu attempt (1 target, easy to keep track):

 

23 of 23 Doom ticks crit = 23 Wild Imps

2 Demonic Calling buffs gained = 3 Wild Imps (I assume the initial buff isn't marked within WoL)

2 Imp Swarms (I always cast them with Dark Soul, had 2 Dark Souls) = 10 imps

 

So 36 imps in 3 minutes 42 seconds.

 

Let's run this same situation without UVoLS and with the change to Imp Swarm in 5.4.  Let's also say that I run around 30% crit to try it out.

 

8 of of 23 Doom ticks crit (being slightly generous) = 8 Wild Imps

2 Demonic Calling buffs gained = 3 Wild Imps

2 Imp Swarms = 8 Wild Imps

 

19 Wild Imps in 3 minutes 42 seconds.

 

Our imp generation is cut nearly in half assuming 30% crit and RNG isn't brutal.

 

In my example where I had 36 imps, they cast a total of 348 Fel Firebolts.  That's a total of 1740 Demonic Fury generated in a very small duration.

 

Cut in half, that would be 870.  That's almost a full bar of energy we're losing, again, in a very small span of time.  A lot of which I'm able to take advantage of with our current 2-piece.  Once we shed ourselves of that we're looking at not only much less DF generated, but less efficient use of it during Dark Soul.  Apparently Demonology is doing fine on the PTR anyway, but like I said, I feel like it's going to be wierd getting used to the new rate at which we'll acquire DF.

Edited August 5, 2013 by Omaric

[Zagam 1,982]

Remember, you won't be using Glyph of Imp Swarm as a necessity.  I actually think I'll be running without it.  I think Imp Swarm will be beneficial at the Haste thresholds (20%, 40%) but not using the glyph will be slightly better otherwise.  Personally, I prefer the constant DF generation, but some like that burst.  Without the glyph, you'll be getting an Imp every 20 seconds reduced by Haste. 

 

Also, without UVLS, you won't be using Glyph of Everlasting Affliction, so your Doom damage will be going up 20% at the sacrifice of casting it slightly more often.  You'll also be getting 20% more damage from Corruption and having to monitor it more closely to not let it fall off (back from our 40 sec duration to 24).  While yes, we are losing Imps, losing Imp damage, and losing Imp DF generation, it's noteworthy to mention the gain of more consistent DF generation without Wild Imp glyph, 20% increased Doom and Corruption damage, and that the change to KJC doesn't affect Demonology.  Demonology will still be able to move and cast with planning giving it the option of Manno's Fury or 2 Dark Soul uses.  The reason I think Glyph of Imp Swarm will go away is your Imp Swarm will only last one Dark Soul whereas your consistent flow of Imps would benefit from your 40 seconds of Dark Soul. 

 

The fact GC called UVLS and Glyph of EA an 'exploit' enrages me.  What else did they possibly think would happen when they give you a trinket that guarantees crits for 4 seconds?  We simply used what was given to us and maximized its potency.  I don't remember the nerf to Shard of Woe when it made Arcane Mages spam Arcane Blast for the rest of Cataclysm.  We'll adapt and be better. 

 

Another note in terms of what I've seen in the PTR...remember you get Demonic Fury when you kill an enemy in Metamorphosis form.  This is often an oversight, but you get a large chunk of DF when you kill something.  When I solo Warbringers, I'll be at like 200 DF and it'll spawn a scarab swarm.  Pop HoG -> Meta and bam, instant 1000 DF.  Seeing all the adds in this raid, especially with Garrosh, makes me think that DF generation won't be much of an issue at all.

[Omaric 246]

Well, glyph of Everlasting Affliction will straight up cease to exist, so yeah.

 

I'm coming at it from the perspective of pure DF generation, regardless of how much damage Doom and Corruption does, that doesn't change.  I've explained before why I thought Imp Swarm will still be better based on the fact that we receive more DF during Dark Soul (if you always time Imp Swarm with DS you will have more DF during DS), which is important.  I realize that we can get 2 Dark Souls off with Archimonde's.... whatever he's feeling like these days.  If I was using that talent, I would probably save it for erratic buff timers, such as Jin'Rokh pools.  It gives you more flexibility.  I don't see using it as a means to go with back to back Dark Souls, especially when your trinkets have probably worn off by the time #2 hits.

 

I agree though that GC calling Demonology's interaction with UVoLS an exploit is the dumbest crock of shit I've heard him say in awhile.

 

Yes, the DF gain from killing adds is always something I keep in the back of my mind.  It's just too random to actually count on snagging the killing blow to rely on it.  I can see it being easier with a 10-man where you can call out that you'll finish them off, but when you have 3 fire mages in your raid that are about to jizz their pants to Combustion, I can't count on it.

[Nytemare 2]

The fact GC called UVLS and Glyph of EA an 'exploit' enrages me.  What else did they possibly think would happen when they give you a trinket that guarantees crits for 4 seconds?  We simply used what was given to us and maximized its potency.  I don't remember the nerf to Shard of Woe when it made Arcane Mages spam Arcane Blast for the rest of Cataclysm.  We'll adapt and be better.

I agree there is no way they were that naive and didn't expect us to use it that way, all we did was

use it the right way

[Alphric 7]

My brain hurts

[Demyndra 6]

According to WowDB, it looks like the amplification trinket was nerfed more.... now it says 7% increase to mastery, crit and haste, for the normal mode trinket. 8% for heroic... and 8% for heroic warforged.

Wowhead has it at 13% for normal, 14% for normal warforged, 15% heroic, and 16% HWF, 12% for flex, and 10% for LFR... good lord that's just too many versions.

At least it drops off the first boss, so people won't have to wait 5 to 6 weeks to reach the 11th or 12th boss and hope it drops.

[Zagam 1,982]

I use ptr.wowhead.com, so if there are other versions, I haven't seen them.  I think there was a discrepency with the Tier gloves as well.  I guess we'll see when we see.  TBH, 10-16% amplification on Haste and Mastery ratings along with critical hit damage is a bit overpowered.

[JvChequer 43]

Looks like they don't want THE Bis trinket.

 

Btw, I wonder if the multristike proc can proc the cleave effect of the other one.

Edited August 7, 2013 by JvChequer

[JvChequer 43]

http://ptr.wowdb.com/items/105422-purified-bindings-of-immerseus

 

http://ptr.wowdb.com/items/105648-black-blood-of-yshaarj

 

http://ptr.wowdb.com/items/96785-wushoolays-final-choice

 

http://ptr.wowdb.com/items/96827-breath-of-the-hydra

 

 

 

 

Wow, if that is correct, it's a big nerf on all RPPM Trinkets, 10sec CD only.

 

And makes Black Blood looks lame with 10sec duration and 10 stacks.

Edited August 7, 2013 by JvChequer

[Zagam 1,982]

The RPPM values got adjusted.  Some of them improved, some declined, but the difference on all of them was marginal.  The nerf to the RPPM trinkets was the 90 second threshold set when you start combat making Wush, Breath, and UVLS not proc at the beginning of fights unless you were super lucky.

[JvChequer 43]

No, look, they change de duration to 10sec instead of 20.