Dps Drop after living bomb explosion

[kuraigu 0]

first of all hello to all of and on icy veins!

i've read the guide and its very well written and helpful.

though, when i'm practicing on a dummy and use the dps realtime meter,

i've noticed that the dps drops down alot after living bomb explodes.

is this normal or am i doing something wrong?

i begin with the orb, then casting living bomb, scorch and

continue with fireball until pyroblast is proccing.

then i'm trying to keep up fireball, living bomb, pyroblast, ignite dots

the start combution when combustionhelper is green.

all fine, but still. somehow i'm doing something wrong.

only 30k dps in ogrimmar on the 3 88lvl dummies.

my gearscore is 10774 and ilvl is 397.

http://eu.battle.net...úrâîgù/advanced

can anyone tell me what i'm doing wrong of if i've configured my char wrong?

thanks in advance!!

[LCSscallywag 57]

Mind relinking your Armory in english? I don't know German and google won't translate it properly for me.

[Stoove 347]

Are you stacking Crit too much? I know that stacking too much Crit can reduce performance due to the Ignite mechanic not working as it does at face value (this is kown as "Ignite Munching") - have you tried reforging or simming?

Edited June 22, 2012 by Stoove

[MadMonk 154]

Armory in english: http://eu.battle.net...úrâîgù/advanced

just change 'eu.battle.net/wow/de/...' to 'eu.battle.net/wow/en/...'

[LCSscallywag 57]

Armory in english: http://eu.battle.net...úrâîgù/advanced

just change 'eu.battle.net/wow/de/...' to 'eu.battle.net/wow/en/...'

It's my first day on the internet. Sorry..:P

[Damien 1,514]

Hey and thank you for the nice comments about my Fire Mage guide.

When reporting a problem like this, you need to be really precise, otherwise it is really hard to figure out what the problem might be.

You say that you experience a DPS drop when you let Living Bomb explode. So, it would mean that if you refresh Living Bomb before it explodes, then you do more DPS. I find it extremely hard to believe, seeing as the explosion represents about 25% of the damage that Living Bomb deals. The only way I see for this to happen is if, after the explosion, it takes you more than 2 seconds to recast Living Bomb.

Moreover, you say that you are testing on 3 dummies at a time. This would make the explosion of Living Bomb even more powerful (provided the 3 dummies are close to each other). This is yet another reason why it is hard to believe that the explosion ruins your DPS.

I think you should do 2 experiments on a single dummy (take one that has no other dummy next to it).

• Deal 5,000,000 damage with the rotation that we advise in our guide (let Living Bomb explode).
• Deal 5,000,000 damage with the same rotation, just that you try not to let Living Bomb explode.

For each of the two experiments, I need to know how much DPS you did, and the percentage of damage you did with each spell.

[kuraigu 0]

hello damien.

well, in the dps realtime meter, the dps goes up abit when living bomb explodes, that is correct.

but after that it drops down alot like if i'd be doing nothing for atleast a second.

is the way i use the rotation correct?

[kuraigu 0]

stoove .. i dont know if i'm stacking crit too much. how can i check about it?

[Damien 1,514]

It seems to be correct. When you say DPS real time meter, is it the feature of recount where you can show the variation in your DPS (with the graph)?

If yes, then you should know that this feature is useless for measuring the value of your rotation. It is mostly useful for raid leaders who need to know if their raid can pull out the required amount of DPS for a short burst phase.

In you case, what is important is your average DPS over the course of a fight or over an uninterrupted period of uptime on a training dummy.

[kuraigu 0]

i have just tried what you told me, going for 5m damage. my dps was at 25k. using all except mirror and bloodlust.

with my gear 25k isn't enough on an 88 test dummy, right?

this was with letting living bomb explode.

Recount - Kúrâîgù's Hostile Attacks

• Spell - Count - Damage - (percentage)
• 1. Feuerball 63 1867735 (38%)
• 2. Entzünden (DoT) 55 796624 (16%)
• 3. Lebende Bombe (DoT) 69 600127 (12%)
• 4. Einäschern (DoT) 24 379053 (8%)
• 5. Pyroschlag! 7 353199 (7%)
• 6. Lebende Bombe 13 204072 (4%)
• 7. Pyroschlag! (DoT) 33 187757 (4%)
• 8. Schattenblitzsalve 20 182023 (4%)
• 9. Flammenkugel 44 162912 (3%)
• 10. Schlag der Verderbnis (DoT) 45 100604 (2%)

[Damien 1,514]

I think it'd be a lot easier for us to help you if you took the time to translate the spells in English.

[kuraigu 0]

I think it'd be a lot easier for us to help you if you took the time to translate the spells in English.

will do so. i've switched WoW to english, but the report was still in german.

Recount - Kúrâîgù's Hostile Attacks

• Spell - Count - Damage - (percentage)
• 1. Fireball 63 1867735 (38%)
• 2. Ignite (DoT) 55 796624 (16%)
• 3. Living Bomb (DoT) 69 600127 (12%)
• 4. Combustion (DoT) 24 379053 (8%)
• 5. Pyroblats! 7 353199 (7%)
• 6. Living Bomb 13 204072 (4%)
• 7. Pyroblast! (DoT) 33 187757 (4%)
• 8. Shadow Bolt Volley 20 182023 (4%)
• 9. Flame Orb 44 162912 (3%)
• 10. Blast of Corruption (DoT) 45 100604 (2%)

[Damien 1,514]

It looks pretty good, in my opinion. You need to realize that Fire benefits a lot from the various raid buffs, so it's normal that you feel it performs poorly on a training dummy. Go in LFR, and try that rotation on Ultraxion, I'm convinced you will do very well.

[Alierya 94]

I think the german spell names sound much better

Recount - Kúrâîgù's Hostile Attacks

• Spell - Count - Damage - (percentage)
• 5. Pyroschlag! 7 353199 (7%)

Being my personal favourite, although Flammenkugel is also pretty sweet.

Though in other news I also agree with Damien, I seem to do far better in raid with my FM than on a target dummy.

[kuraigu 0]

so i've tried ultraxion on LFR, cant remember how much dps i've done.

do you guys use combustion helper, and if yes. what threshhold are you using for ignite?

[Damien 1,514]

Personally, I don't use Combustion Helper. And you should have noted the DPS you did on Ultraxion! But I'm sure that if you had performed poorly, you would have remembered ;)

[Stoove 347]

stoove .. i dont know if i'm stacking crit too much. how can i check about it?

I'm afraid I'm well out of my depth on exactly how much Crit you want (I suspect that's something that has to be simmed). You can find more information on Ignite Munching in the link I posted the first time round. Good luck! :)

[Damien 1,514]

I don't think you can stack Crit too much as a Fire Mage.

[Stoove 347]

I don't think you can stack Crit too much as a Fire Mage.

I linked the Elitist Jerks section on "Ignite Munching" as backup for my comment. I understand that there *is* a point somewhere that means Crit doesn't give you as much of a DPS benefit any more. I have no idea what that is, though - suspect that has to be simmed.

[Damien 1,514]

I linked the Elitist Jerks section on "Ignite Munching" as backup for my comment. I understand that there *is* a point somewhere that means Crit doesn't give you as much of a DPS benefit any more. I have no idea what that is, though - suspect that has to be simmed.

The EJ post is slightly outdated. Since patch 4.1, Ignite Munching is no longer as much of an issue as it used to be.

Ignite is no longer triggered from periodic critical effects.

In the past, you would get a lot of Ignite Munching when a crit from a DoT would happen right after or right before a crit with a regular spell.

Let's look at whoever is ranked #1 on Ultraxion 25H as a Fire Mage: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/neptulon/Pichenci/advanced

As you can see, this guy is reforging crit even though he's already got so much of it.

[Vladamyr 169]

I just simmed you Kuraigu and i'm showing a minor dps gain to reforge from your 2005 haste rating (25%) soft cap into crit. From a real world standpoint I believe that reforging from haste to crit will be an even bigger factor. Haste really only starts to catch up if you are a master at maximizing your combustion. I would try reforging Hit>Crit>Haste>Mastery. Anyone with at least LFR gear should have plenty of haste to reach the 15% soft cap without having to reforge to it. One thing i did not see in the fire mage guide is using mirror images. You should be maximizing your Mirror image use as it is a good source of damage. I thought i remembered reading that you did not want the minor glyph of mirror image though? Could someone verify or check that? I personally do use combustion helper. For my settings i turn off the ignite prediction and set my threshold at 13k.I am only at 387 ilvl though (so your threshold may be higher) as my mage has taken a backseat to my pally for this tier. (I would like to say I am more and more in agreement with Damien and think just watching for big crits is the way to go instead of using Combustion Helper but it's good for getting started.)

Make sure you are spamming that fireball key so that you have no delay in between casts - This was my biggest gain of dps on my mage since I was failing early on by just trying to time the start of the next cast after the previous. Just pound that fireball key!

[Stoove 347]

The EJ post is slightly outdated. Since patch 4.1, Ignite Munching is no longer as much of an issue as it used to be.

In the past, you would get a lot of Ignite Munching when a crit from a DoT would happen right after or right before a crit with a regular spell.

Aha, I see now. Thanks for pointing that out Damien! (bloody EJ not keeping their guides up-to-date grumble grumble!)

I just simmed you Kuraigu and i'm showing a minor dps gain to reforge from your 2005 haste rating (25%) soft cap into crit. From a real world standpoint I believe that reforging from haste to crit will be an even bigger factor.

Vlad, is there any chance you can write a quick guide on simming for the forums? I'd be very interested in trying it out for myself but I've been daunted by how it sounds...

[Damien 1,514]

I just simmed you Kuraigu and i'm showing a minor dps gain to reforge from your 2005 haste rating (25%) soft cap into crit. From a real world standpoint I believe that reforging from haste to crit will be an even bigger factor. Haste really only starts to catch up if you are a master at maximizing your combustion. I would try reforging Hit>Crit>Haste>Mastery. Anyone with at least LFR gear should have plenty of haste to reach the 15% soft cap without having to reforge to it. One thing i did not see in the fire mage guide is using mirror images. You should be maximizing your Mirror image use as it is a good source of damage. I thought i remembered reading that you did not want the minor glyph of mirror image though? Could someone verify or check that? I personally do use combustion helper. For my settings i turn off the ignite prediction and set my threshold at 13k.I am only at 387 ilvl though (so your threshold may be higher) as my mage has taken a backseat to my pally for this tier. (I would like to say I am more and more in agreement with Damien and think just watching for big crits is the way to go instead of using Combustion Helper but it's good for getting started.)

Make sure you are spamming that fireball key so that you have no delay in between casts - This was my biggest gain of dps on my mage since I was failing early on by just trying to time the start of the next cast after the previous. Just pound that fireball key!

What Vladamyr says is very sensible. It is very important not to go out of your way to reach the 25% soft haste cap. Rather, this cap should be considered as an interesting Haste Rating value after which we don't want Haste anymore. But, before reaching this value, we want Haste Rating and Critical Strike Rating in balanced amounts.

You are right about Mirror Image, so I added a small mention of it in the DPS cooldown section. The corresponding glyph makes no difference as a Fire Mage (I tested this last month following a Facebook comment). It only makes a difference as Arcane because it makes the images cast their own Arcane Blast, which benefits from your own stacks on the target.

[Vladamyr 169]

Vlad, is there any chance you can write a quick guide on simming for the forums? I'd be very interested in trying it out for myself but I've been daunted by how it sounds...

I will try to post something later on this week about using Simcraft, but I am no expert . I have only just started getting comfortable with it. It's help section is very well written though and you shouldn't feel daunted by trying it out.

[kuraigu 0]

hi again.

i just played ultraxion HC and had 30k dps. is that ok?