protection build

[Satyroman 0]

im wondering if control/haste build are so much better then a control/mastery build in tot and general ??

 

this is my current gear ( i been unlcuky with drops sadly )

 

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/defias-brotherhood/Satyroman/advanced

 

so far my control/mastery build have worked fine but in raids i feel my threat is low compared to other tanks and I feel that im under performing in raids

 

any advice is welcome or questions

[Retmoo 0]

Hi Satyroman,

 

the control/mastery build should be viable for you in raids and with the way vengeance works you should not really have any trouble with threat unless the other tanks out gear you by a huge margin.

 

im going to guess that the most often times you have issues would be on the pull or when performing a tank swap?

 

if thats the case there are a couple of little tricks you can do to make it easier to hold threat.

 

there is a great thread here on icy veins that explains vengeance in detail but the basic concept is you gain a percentage of UNMITIGATED damage received  as attack power, meaning you hit harder/ generate more threat. to use this to your advantage you could opt to not have Sacred Shield on when you taunt the boss, you will get hit harder and the stacks will increase faster.

 

Another great spell we have in our arsenal is Hand of Salvation. This will remove all the targets threat for 10 seconds. you can use this to your advantage by taunting the boss which will focus you for 3 seconds, then pop Salvation on the other tank and give you the breathing room and time you need to build threat.

 

I've found these tricks to be quite useful when raiding as the Blood DK in our group is just as geared as me, but when performing a tank swap there is always a chance he could rip threat back from the high stacks of vengeance we get from our favourite pastime on normal modes "stand in all the bad stuff and get a Vengeance High Score!!"

 

Hope this has helped

 

Retmoo 

[Satyroman 0]

its mainly on pulls i have agro trouble and sometimes on tank swaps and thx for the input

[Horcored 17]

Also, u asked if haste/controll is better than mastery/control in general. The answer is, in terms of dmg midigation the difference isnt to to noticeable overall, just that u get smoother dmg income, instead of in spikes. But in terms of dmg throughput haste/control is the way to go.

Also if u dont cound the dmg u do, i'd still prefer haste build, cuz it gives u a much smoother dmg intake, instead of the spikey income from mastery build.

[Vladamyr 169]

Always have Sacred Shield active prepull.  Control/Haste build is way ahead of any other build in terms of both dps and survivability.

[Retmoo 0]

Sorry Vladamyr,

 

perhaps i didnt explain my thinking properly.

while i did say "opt to not have Sacred Shield up when pulling the boss or tank swapping" i didnt mean dont have it on at all during the fight.

 

Sacred Shied scales with Vengeance so if you run in with it up before the pull you will want to apply it again soon to take advantage of the increase in absorbs due to vengeance, so i  dont see how it could be a bad thing to skip it for the first 5-10 seconds.

 

on the pull is probably the safest time to go without sacred shield up since all the healers will have already applied hots and shields.

 

Having looked at the OP's gear they will want to be grabbing a few more higher lvl pieces before they move across to a control/ haste build, or even a few items with haste already.

 

figured it would be better to provide a solution so that in the mean time while they gather more gear they can enjoy raiding with their guild and feel that they are contributing to the best of their ability

 

Retmoo

[Vladamyr 169]

on the pull is probably the safest time to go without sacred shield up since all the healers will have already applied hots and shields.

 

The threat gain from not having the shield up is negligible.  Don't do that .  If you are losing threat it's from 1 of 2 things; either bad rotation or you're under geared compared to your group.  Use Holy Avenger or Sanctified Wrath on the pull for additional threat.

 

I mention the control/haste only to let the OP know what they should be working towards.

 

Make sure to come back and check the guides once 5.4 drops.  There will be some changes.  Enjoy!

 

 

[Tengenstein 11]

there is a great thread here on icy veins that explains vengeance in detail but the basic concept is you gain a percentage of UNMITIGATED damage received  as attack power, meaning you hit harder/ generate more threat. to use this to your advantage you could opt to not have Sacred Shield on when you taunt the boss, you will get hit harder and the stacks will increase faster.

 

You've got the wrong end of the stick here, unmitigated damage means the damage before absorbtion and damage reduction affects are caclulated, not if you block a 150k melee hit you take 100k damage, but becuase vengenance works on unmitigated damage its still calculates vengeance as if you took a 150k hit. if you have a 300k absorb up and takea 150k hit, you take 0 damage but still get vengenace as if you had taken a 150K hit. if you have weakened blows up the 150k hit becomes a 135k, except for calculating vengeance where it still counts as a 150k hit.

 

think about it, if vengeance was affected by absorbs and damage reductions,  your DPS and TPS would go down as you geared up, as you became harder to kill you're under geared mate would rip aggro off you. the whole Haste/controll build wouldn't be the DPS monter that it is becuase it also being the survival monster would end up screwing you vengenace generation up.

 

it's the same deal that warriors used to have when rage generation  based of damage taken if a shield was up the game ignored it for calcualting rage gen. prior to wrath we weren't a great fan of disco priests as before then we actually had to take the damage, but after wrath they tweaked it so we  gained age through absorbtion affects, and didn't macro /cancelaura Power word: shield

[Tyrendorf 1]

Hi Satyroman,

I wish only to point that switching just now to haste/control build can be problematic, due to your low ilvl (your stam will be lower in a pure haste build). I suggest you change reforges for haste but keep some stam gems. Or get a stam trinket to use it when necessary. 

[Satyroman 0]

thanks for the input and im getting a stamina trinket asap i can get more valors  and lfr/normal tot wont give me loot drops :(

 

but always nice to hear ppls advices