How much Haste does it take to not make my Frost Mage suck?

[smtips 5]

How much haste, what percent would be reasonable to make a frost mage not feel like all I'm doing is waiting for slowass frost bolts to proc brain freeze? Seems like a large part of frost is casting frostbolt and it's just not that fun if it's not gonna be faster.

PLEASE don't give me the canned "go sim your character" nonsense, I'm doing decent DPS for iLvl 904 and know the rotation pretty well.

I have 33.12% Haste and it's still pretty crappy to play frost because it's just too slow.

Edited June 30, 2017 by smtips

[Wolfdy 1]

"PLEASE don't give me the canned "go sim your character" nonsense, I'm doing decent DPS for iLvl 904 and know the rotation pretty well."

If you're saying that you probaly never simed your character in the first place lol

Lemme explian it to you, once you get some value of a certain stat it starts to give you less benefits than the other stats due sinergy, SimulationCraft can weight your current stats and tell you "every point of crit you give you 18.8 dps in your currant gear, while every point of versatility can give you 22.7 dps on your gear" since every mage has a diferent gear your stats WILL be diferent from the others, so no man, we cant give you another tip other then SIm your character, because that's the real and good awenser to your question.

An exemple to that would be my frost mage, frost mages with Gs build usualy go for Crit until shatter and Versa after, however my mages it's putting crit already as my lower stat even before the crit cap, that's something i can only find via a simulation

If you tell me your characters name, realm and deslog in your current build i could sim it to you as an exemple this time only and post it here, that way you can understand why everybody's giving you the " go sim your character nonsense"

Edited July 1, 2017 by Wolfdy

[Caltsu 0]

 

7 hours ago, Wolfdy said:

"PLEASE don't give me the canned "go sim your character" nonsense, I'm doing decent DPS for iLvl 904 and know the rotation pretty well."

If you're saying that you probaly never simed your character in the first place lol

Lemme explian it to you, once you get some value of a certain stat it starts to give you less benefits than the other stats due sinergy, SimulationCraft can weight your current stats and tell you "every point of crit you give you 18.8 dps in your currant gear, while every point of versatility can give you 22.7 dps on your gear" since every mage has a diferent gear your stats WILL be diferent from the others, so no man, we cant give you another tip other then SIm your character, because that's the real and good awenser to your question.

An exemple to that would be my frost mage, frost mages with Gs build usualy go for Crit until shatter and Versa after, however my mages it's putting crit already as my lower stat even before the crit cap, that's something i can only find via a simulation

If you tell me your characters name, realm and deslog in your current build i could sim it to you as an exemple this time only and post it here, that way you can understand why everybody's giving you the " go sim your character nonsense"

WHOOOSHH! That was exactly the response that wasn't asked and you answered to the wrong question.

He wasn't asking how to improve his dps, he was asking when will his mage start to FEEL better.

Now, smtips, I feel like no amount of haste will make frostbolt spamming feel better. It's just the reality of frost that we are an extremely rng based spec. I have 916 equipped gear and I too have to sometimes cast 10+ frostbolts without any procs and it feels AWFUL. The rotation feels the better the more procs you will get and there is only so much we can do to help that. Clarity of Thought relics increase the amount of Brain Freeze procs, t19 2pc will give another 5% BF proc chance, and t20 4pc will reduce your Frozen Orb cooldown each time you gain a BF proc. Those will help you reduce the bad frostbolt streaks but they will still happen from time to time unfortunately.

[Tehril 12]

The issue is that you're coming to the forums asking "How do I make this game fun", and the honest truth is that no class in this game is going to be fun just on it's own. The APM requirements for World of Warcraft are very low, and the complexity of many specs boils down to "If this, then use this"and pressing the button that just became shiny. If you aren't having fun spamming frostbolts wishing for procs, haste isn't going to solve that, about 40% of your uptime on any boss fight will generally be used casting frostbolts while longingly glancing at that Ice Lance keybind wishing for some of those sweet mil and a half to 2mil crits for free.

[smtips 5]

On 6/30/2017 at 7:57 PM, Wolfdy said:

"PLEASE don't give me the canned "go sim your character" nonsense, I'm doing decent DPS for iLvl 904 and know the rotation pretty well."

If you're saying that you probaly never simed your character in the first place lol

Lemme explian it to you, once you get some value of a certain stat it starts to give you less benefits than the other stats due sinergy, SimulationCraft can weight your current stats and tell you "every point of crit you give you 18.8 dps in your currant gear, while every point of versatility can give you 22.7 dps on your gear" since every mage has a diferent gear your stats WILL be diferent from the others, so no man, we cant give you another tip other then SIm your character, because that's the real and good awenser to your question.

An exemple to that would be my frost mage, frost mages with Gs build usualy go for Crit until shatter and Versa after, however my mages it's putting crit already as my lower stat even before the crit cap, that's something i can only find via a simulation

If you tell me your characters name, realm and deslog in your current build i could sim it to you as an exemple this time only and post it here, that way you can understand why everybody's giving you the " go sim your character nonsense"

Holy crap you should READ FIRST. I told you not to do that. DUH. If you're SO closed-minded to anyone's questions then well, don't respond. I did NOT ask you how to improve my DPS. :) Stop being such an elitist, have you forgotten that once you were not the pro you think you are now? Cut people some slack LOL. And yes I use simcraft, and YES it's broken, have a look at the forum for it. Can't even compare any gear.

Edited July 2, 2017 by smtips
change

[smtips 5]

18 hours ago, Caltsu said:

 

WHOOOSHH! That was exactly the response that wasn't asked and you answered to the wrong question.

He wasn't asking how to improve his dps, he was asking when will his mage start to FEEL better.

Now, smtips, I feel like no amount of haste will make frostbolt spamming feel better. It's just the reality of frost that we are an extremely rng based spec. I have 916 equipped gear and I too have to sometimes cast 10+ frostbolts without any procs and it feels AWFUL. The rotation feels the better the more procs you will get and there is only so much we can do to help that. Clarity of Thought relics increase the amount of Brain Freeze procs, t19 2pc will give another 5% BF proc chance, and t20 4pc will reduce your Frozen Orb cooldown each time you gain a BF proc. Those will help you reduce the bad frostbolt streaks but they will still happen from time to time unfortunately.

Thanks. These other guys posting don't seem to "get it." Good enough, and yes the RNG pretty much sucks at times and is wonderful at other times, and yes all my relics have the +1 Brain Freeze and playing frost still is boring with the spamming slow frost bolts. I guess I'll work on 40% and the t19 2PC (hard to get for me because I'm really not a mythic+ player or heroic raid player).

Cheers, thanks again, and no thanks to the other closed-minded people who can't understand LOL. I really don't care if I'm top DPS in fights, I'd just like the character to play better.

Edited July 2, 2017 by smtips
change

[Bronad 3]

Well, no....

Your thread title clearly says "How much Haste does it take to not make my Frost Mage suck?" and not "How much haste do I need to have fun?". If you want to favour fun over performance, stack haste with no regard for anything else - what a dumb conversation. It's like asking "what talents should I take to have more fun?". Who the hell knows...

He gave you a completely reasonable reply to an otherwise vague and subjective question.

[Paigey 0]

OP if you want more "fun" out of mage,  try going arcane.   Like frost it's based around some RNG factors but it can really blow things up,  give it a try. 

[Vayra 12]

On 7/2/2017 at 2:11 PM, Alcasczar said:

OP if you want more "fun" out of mage,  try going arcane.   Like frost it's based around some RNG factors but it can really blow things up,  give it a try. 

This. If I get my Arcane Mage in burst I'm spamming 0.8 second cast time Arcane Blasts for almost no mana cost, and that's even without using Temporal Flux (which can be a free talent...). That's 2.4M-3.2M crits every 0.8 sec. Arcane Missiles fly out faster than I can count them. And all of this can be done on the move if you're really in a sugar rush. As to the quote above; RNG? Arcane has almost none of it... Fire and Frost are RNG based, Arcane is very much not so unless you're using lego Bracers.

Also, if you want fast frostbolts, pick up an Erratic Metronome + Whispers and enjoy.

The above isn't rocket science, and your flame towards people who really wanted to point you towards a valid argument (you really should start simming at least once for a baseline) is completely out of place if you re-read your topic title. Next time, phrase your post better and you get better responses.

All of that doesn't change the fact that you pose a weird topic in the first place. Frost doesn't suck, didn't suck, and won't suck. It just dropped off a few % on the top lists. If you ask questions on this forum however, those lists don't apply to you in any case. Way different league. Get your basic knowledge down first, is my suggestion.

Edited July 4, 2017 by Vayra

[ShadyBoxface 0]

your looking for certain stat weights to make you like your class/spec again?

im sorry but the problem you have can not be fixed on these forums or thru any suggestions on change of play style/stats...maybe you should try go fish or perhaps checkers? life is simple there...you should do fine, cant be expected to sim

[Tracing 2]

Just stacking a single stat won't change your RNG for stat-independent procs. That's just the way frost mage is. If you think Simcraft is broken, you were probably using the 7.2.0 version and not 7.2.5 that is released in the nightly builds section.

Frost mage tends to be really proc-based in general. Without running 2 set for T19, brain freeze procs are going to be a bit harder to come by. Seeing as how you apparently have triple BF relics, you really should be getting enough, as it's almost the same as somebody who has no relics but T19 2 piece. Fortunately, you shouldn't be too irked about this since spamming frostbolts will generate more crits for IV to be back up sooner, alleviating some of the RNG that is inherent in the spec. Obviously, it would be nice for a brain freeze proc to guarantee a crit, but sometimes you're not going to have that. Also, having 4 set for T20 is nice as well since you get 5 seconds off a guaranteed FoF generator in Frozen Orb for each Brain Freeze proc you get.

To be honest, I don't find the RNG that awful even without T19 2 piece or a single BF relic, although I guess anything better now that I'm no longer maining DH.

Something that irks me though, is that you don't seem to be open to what people are telling you about things. You say you don't like doing M+ or heroic raiding, yet these things are what you need to do if you want things like set bonuses that make the spec better to play, and are looking for an easy out of "can I just stack a stat". You only get out of your character what you put in, and stacking haste won't change RNG.

[Fendorn009 0]

On 7/4/2017 at 10:44 AM, Vayra said:

This. If I get my Arcane Mage in burst I'm spamming 0.8 second cast time Arcane Blasts for almost no mana cost, and that's even without using Temporal Flux (which can be a free talent...). That's 2.4M-3.2M crits every 0.8 sec. Arcane Missiles fly out faster than I can count them. And all of this can be done on the move if you're really in a sugar rush. As to the quote above; RNG? Arcane has almost none of it... Fire and Frost are RNG based, Arcane is very much not so unless you're using lego Bracers.

Also, if you want fast frostbolts, pick up an Erratic Metronome + Whispers and enjoy.

The above isn't rocket science, and your flame towards people who really wanted to point you towards a valid argument (you really should start simming at least once for a baseline) is completely out of place if you re-read your topic title. Next time, phrase your post better and you get better responses.

All of that doesn't change the fact that you pose a weird topic in the first place. Frost doesn't suck, didn't suck, and won't suck. It just dropped off a few % on the top lists. If you ask questions on this forum however, those lists don't apply to you in any case. Way different league. Get your basic knowledge down first, is my suggestion.

Vayra,

What the heck are you doing to make that go so damn quick??I tried it recently in LFR(don't have a lot into the extra traits except the new 4) is that what's doing it for you?

[Vayra 12]

On 18-7-2017 at 5:55 AM, Fendorn009 said:

Vayra,

What the heck are you doing to make that go so damn quick??I tried it recently in LFR(don't have a lot into the extra traits except the new 4) is that what's doing it for you?

Time Warp + 30%

Whispers of the Dark +41%

Temporal Flux +20% base

Erratic Metronome +720haste per proc

There are many, many ways to get speedy. And these days the gear is easy to get too, Nighthold isn't exactly top tier anymore ;)

Edited July 19, 2017 by Vayra