MW Monk Confusion and Desperation

[sunshiney121 0]

Hello Monk community,

    I am having some issues with my mistweaver's healing numbers. I have talked to several different monks in game, read so much information on the internet to find out how I can be better. I'm still struggling, and becoming more frustrated.
    I'm sorry if anyone feels I could have found answers somewhere else without posting here, but I have tried and I am desperate for help.
    Now on to my concerns. http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/area-52/Chinooki/simple  there is my armory. http://www.askmrrobot.com/wow/gear/usa/area_52/chinooki  and there is my mrrobot link.I'm 509ilvl, I'm going for the crit build, not sure I can afford to do the low spirit build yet as I don't have the legendary meta gem. If you think I should go low spirit let me know I was told by one monk that I would be better off just dumping everything into crit, and ignoring the haste BP, does anyone else share this view?
    I have to work on replacing my mastery pieces. Unless I'm missing something huge gear wise or replacing those mastery pieces will make a massive difference then I still have other concerns.
    My concerns are about the spells I should be casting. I'm LFR-ing and Flexing. I feel like I have to struggle so much just to break 40k in LFR. I believe my top heals should be ReM and Uplift. I try this and when I manage my Mana Tea well and TFT it is semi-effective and I usually hit 30k+, I see other monks in the same LFR beating me and their top spells include Enveloping Mist. So is Enveloping a better choice for chi spending than Uplift and ReM blanketing?
    Here's how I approach a fight.
Place statue, keep ReM up on at least 6. Mana Tea as needed. Chi Wave on CD. Soothing on the tank while I use ReM on CD and TFT to get it on 10+ ppl if possible and then I unleash Uplifts. I don't cast Surging at all, sometimes I do Enveloping on the tank if they drop super low. I can be forgetful about chi wave, chi torpedo, revival and at times TFT. I believe this is the correct idea so I'm not sure why I struggle to even hit 40k.  I don't have mana problems unless I just zone out and don't pay attention to mana tea and my trinkets.
    It's really frustrating to work so hard on my monk to do 40k  with 509 ilvl then hop on my priest and do 30k in 480ilvl while my eyes are closed. Any help you can provide would be incredibly appreciated.
    I apologize for such a long post, I had a lot to say I guess.
Thank you for your time,

~Chinooki
 

[Krazyito 521]

Your play style is correct. The problem is your gear. You have too much mastery and no sockets. Healing monks scale very well from gear / sockets because of how well crit helps with our healing and mana.

Honestly, right now if you want to increase throughput you're going to have to do a low spirit build (5100 spirit cap) with the first breakpoint (3145) and then full crit. I think the biggest problem is just your amount of mastery/lack of crit.

[sunshiney121 0]

First of all, thanks very much for your advice. It's good to hear my play style is correct. I will have to work on the gear I didn't realize how terrible mastery was.

   I do have a question though. How does a low spirit build affect your play style? I mean obviously if it would make you OOM in 10 seconds, it wouldn't be viable and you wouldn't recommend it, but how do you make it work? Is the idea that you would have so much crit you'd be drowning in Mana Tea stacks and there for giving you mana back essentially replacing what spirit did for you?

  Also what did you mean by no sockets?

One last question about the haste bp at 3145, I should have 3145 haste while NOT in Stance of the Wise Serpent correct?

Thanks again

~Chinooki

[Krazyito 521]

Yes, to the mana tea stacks with low spirit. but again don't go below 5100 spirit becasue then fistweaving will not be any helpful should you choose to use it.  If you still feel low on mana, the answer is always more crit.

 

I think at some point there's going to be a time where theres no point in getting more crit (like 45-50%) because you're just critting so often that a higher haste breakpoint would probably help you more just because you are already critting so much.

 

Sockets: because you have all the island gear non of it really has sockets which each socket can amount to 320 crit rating which starts to add up if you have about 1 socket per piece.

 

Yes, 3145 haste OUTSIDE of serpent stance (in tiger stance)

[kika 1]

Hi Sunshiney, you could try this weights.. 

 

http://www.askmrrobot.com/wow/gear/6387ae53-d870-4514-bf4b-3866521c04d2

 

AMR suggests 5058 spirit for your gear atm, feel free to reforge those missing 42 spirit to get to the 5100 (remember not to go under your haste breakpoint if you decide to reforge haste -> spirit). 

 

Regarding the low spirit builds and mana management, it can get quite tricky before you get the legendary meta, specially if you are raiding 10m. But as monks, we have so many ways to deal with this, as you mention the mana/chi/MT interaction is the main source of mana regen. Right now I find myself with more stacks that I can spend, but when I first started with my low spirit build I would find myself OOM when the boss was at not even 70% hp and had to heal with Chi torpedos/chi wave or any other free spell for the rest of the fight. However through that, I realize I was making so many mistakes and made myself use every spell in the massive healing arsenal we have, instead of using the same 5 spells over and over.

 

I think that the only way of getting use to your low spirit build is playing and playing and playing Use LFRs to practice your mana management; flex raids or ToT if you want something more challenging. You'll be fine, if you see you are ooming too much, dont think about getting more spirit, think what can you change to stop using so much mana and keep up with your healing. 

 

What Krazyito meant by socket is gem sockets, I believe. Since you can use them to customize your gear to get whatever stat you want (aka crit =D ). 

 

One more thing and I'm done, you can try and change your Mana Tea glyph for something else like Surging Mist or SCK. Right now Mana Tea got extremely fast making the glyph pretty much useless.

 

I hope I helped in any way

Edited September 25, 2013 by kika

[sunshiney121 0]

Thank you for all the advice guys. Gonna work on the gear!

[Nosyaiel 0]

The timeless isle is your best friend right now for any piece under 496 or even 535, minus weapons. I am one of the few and far between monks who believe mastery is one of the strongest stats we have. Low spirit, haste only to the first cap, and maximizing Mastery, then crit. The benefits of Serpent's embrace ramp up very quickly with spirit, and our tier bonus will only help amplify this. 

Your play style is fine, renewing mist on cooldown, Thunder tea on cooldown, just make sure you're keeping an eye on targets who could use an embrace. 

[Krazyito 521]

The timeless isle is your best friend right now for any piece under 496 or even 535, minus weapons. I am one of the few and far between monks who believe mastery is one of the strongest stats we have. Low spirit, haste only to the first cap, and maximizing Mastery, then crit. The benefits of Serpent's embrace ramp up very quickly with spirit, and our tier bonus will only help amplify this. 

Your play style is fine, renewing mist on cooldown, Thunder tea on cooldown, just make sure you're keeping an eye on targets who could use an embrace. 

 

I'm sorry you disagree with pretty much every other mistweaver (including every single theorycrafter) out there.

 

Mastery is the single worst stat for a mistweaver.  Its worse than strength is for a feral druid. If you are basing how "good" mastery is on the amount of healing it does you are sadly mistaken.  Mastery scales so badly that even if you have 0 rating for 2000 its going to do basically the same amount of healing.  Before I had my legendary cloak, I was at a point in my gear where I had 0 mastery rating.  The only mastery I got was from the raid buff.  Know how much healing it still did?

 

10%.  

 

Yea, thats a significant amount of healing.  but it would never really increase as I gained or lost mastery.   Mastery is such a "random" stat too that there is no way you can control where it goes or who it heals.  Crit will just sky rocket your throughput on top of giving you more mana tea.  If you are choosing to use mastery as your main secondary stat then I sincerely apologize and hope you find out that it really is as bad as we say it is right now.

[Nosyaiel 0]

I'm sorry you disagree with pretty much every other mistweaver (including every single theorycrafter) out there.

 

Mastery is the single worst stat for a mistweaver.  Its worse than strength is for a feral druid. If you are basing how "good" mastery is on the amount of healing it does you are sadly mistaken.  Mastery scales so badly that even if you have 0 rating for 2000 its going to do basically the same amount of healing.  Before I had my legendary cloak, I was at a point in my gear where I had 0 mastery rating.  The only mastery I got was from the raid buff.  Know how much healing it still did?

 

10%.  

 

Yea, thats a significant amount of healing.  but it would never really increase as I gained or lost mastery.   Mastery is such a "random" stat too that there is no way you can control where it goes or who it heals.  Crit will just sky rocket your throughput on top of giving you more mana tea.  If you are choosing to use mastery as your main secondary stat then I sincerely apologize and hope you find out that it really is as bad as we say it is right now.

Please don't post just for an elaborate "you're wrong." An opinion is an opinion, end of story. Mastery does gain numbers as it's increased, and it is a noticeable difference. If your numbers reflect something else, that's fine and you're entitled to your opinion. 

[Krazyito 521]

I'm not basing this on opinion.  Its based on fact from numerous testing since the class has been playable by pretty much every theorycrafter that has looked at the Mistweaver spec.  I would not be pushing or even emphasizing how much you should avoid mastery if it was an opinion. If I knew it was an opinion, then I would never tell people to "get rid of mastery gear"  I tell people to do so because it is a fact to increase throughput.

 

Whatever "increase" you see with mastery, dwarfs in comparison to what you should be able to do with crit.

 

 

For other classes, you can use almost any stat and be pretty viable (opinion). This is not the case with monks. Mastery is not a viable statistic for the Mistweaver Spec (fact).

[trieu 4]

Its arguable mastery is somewhat better in this tier(setb bonus) and this late game with extra stats and all from gear but I agree with Krazy, mastery is pretty bad because how many times do you get through a fight with a bunch of those orbs sitting around because no one steps through which is wasted healing and a wasted stat.

 

Crit and haste are far more valuable because it effects every cast you do and it translates to mana tea in which we can sacrifice spirit into another (crit/haste or gemming more intellect over using gems with spirit on them)and it is throughput and haste increasing casting speed (e.g. really only soothing mist) and ReM ticks which we always have on CD and enveloping mist if you were to cast it.

Edited September 21, 2013 by trieu

[kika 1]

The timeless isle is your best friend right now for any piece under 496 or even 535, minus weapons. I am one of the few and far between monks who believe mastery is one of the strongest stats we have. Low spirit, haste only to the first cap, and maximizing Mastery, then crit. The benefits of Serpent's embrace ramp up very quickly with spirit, and our tier bonus will only help amplify this. 

Your play style is fine, renewing mist on cooldown, Thunder tea on cooldown, just make sure you're keeping an eye on targets who could use an embrace. 

 

Not to try to keep "off topic-ing" but I'm curious to see why you say that mastery is one of the strongest stats we have. I read so many blogs and posts explaining with facts, logs, statistics, math, etc etc why mastery is the worst stat for monks right now.

 

I personally tried both builds and I healed more with the crit build, by far. Maybe, I'm missing something I dont know, but I would like to hear what a mastery believer has to say.

[sunshiney121 0]

Hello everyone,

  So I've updated some gear right now I'm down to about 1000 mastery because I still need to replace my boots and OH. I would say I have noticed a bit of an increase in my numbers since gaining more crit. I was just wondering what your guys' opinion on tier 15 2piece is? Right now I haveFire-Charm Legwraps I also have the tokens for helmet and shoulders. I'm wondering is the 15% increase on ReM per jump from the 2piece worth using an item with mastery as both the helm and shoudlers have mastery?

 

I will mention that I am trying to get the gloves because they have haste, however atm I only have shoulders, pants, and helm. Is it worth using  shoulders or helm with mastery to achieve the 2piece?

Thanks guys.

[trieu 4]

I doubt its worth it, because people are just taking it as its an upgrade and not for the 2 piece.