RoboCouncil and AskMrrobot

[Darkkonan 13]

I've been a long time user of Askmrrobot to keep my gear straight and help out guildies pre-raid with gems, enchants and reforges.  I've also used it a lot to determine gear upgrades... love it.

 

However, recently we have been using the RoboCouncil feature for our raid team... and a few questions keep coming up from my teammates that I just can't answer.  I think I have a pretty good grasp on what the numbers mean... but perhaps I don't because I also am confused sometimes.

 

Basically the problem is.. RoboCouncil will recommend one piece of gear for a certain player over another based on a percentage of upgrade.  Cool...  However, when looking at both player's individual upgrade for that same piece, it will sometimes give a larger upgrade number for the lesser favored player.  For example: Player 1 shows a 4% upgrade which is favored over Player 2 who is showing a 2.5% upgrade.  Now... when looking at looking at the individual list of upgrades for that item slot for both players.. it may say something like, for Player 1 it is a 500 point upgrade, and for Player 2 it is a 1200 point upgrade.  So which player should get the piece?  Am I interpreting these number incorrectly?  Anyone else ever notice this, or can give me an answer that I can pass on to my guildies so we can keep using RoboCouncil in good faith?

 

I really like using the feature and I do have faith that it's doing what it's supposed to.  But if I can't answer the questions my team has about it, then they will loose faith in it and we will end up going back to our loot council, which is slow and sometimes less accurate when deciding who gets what to better our team as a whole.

 

 

[Zoopercat 22]

Hey Darkkonan, I'm from Ask Mr. Robot. Glad you like the site!!

 

A quick question that could clear all of this up: when you look at the individual lists, is the ranking on absolute or relative?

 

Robocouncil uses relative ranking, which takes all other gear into account. Absolute ranking ranks the item in a vacuum, not taking into account hit caps, haste caps, etc. Here's more info on relative v absolute: http://blog.askmrrobot.com/2013/02/gear-lists-relative-vs-absolute-ranking/

[Darkkonan 13]

Thanks Zoopercat for getting back so quickly.  I've actually tried both Absolute and Relative settings.  But if it helps I can actually link you a recent example.

 

This is the screenshot of a piece that dropped during last weeks SoO reg. mode farm.  It brought up some debate.

http://files.enjin.com.s3.amazonaws.com/96488/module_gallery/original/1481883.jpg

 

Here is my info.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/borean-tundra/Darkkonan/advanced

 

Here is my Co-tank.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/borean-tundra/Xylmar/advanced

 

As you can see I ended up with the neck piece we were debating over, since I couldn't convince him it may be an upgrade for him.  The piece I had equipped previously was the Flex item level of the same piece.  It was a small upgrade for me, yes... but since my Co-tank checked his own Askmrrobot profile and it showed as a downgrade it started a debate about whether the Robocouncil was accurate or bugged.  It was then brought up that a similar instance occurred a couple bosses before where we gave a Haste plate waist item to our Warrior dps, because it showed a larger upgrade number on her personal askmrrobot profile then mine... so we gave her the piece against the recommendation of Robocouncil who found it a larger percentage upgrade for me.... which I agreed with since I'm a prot. pally who strives for Haste at all times.

 

The good thing coming from all this is we are looking at the numbers for more answers.  Our bear tank will not give up an Agility piece for one he could reforge into Crit., which was my argument for the neck... since Agility for him gives crit and dodge, but at a rate where he would have had to have about 1.4k agility to get the same crit. gain from reforging.  The dodge increase from Agility mathed out to pretty close to the same and the strength was a wasted stat... and we normally don't factor item level as an upgrade alone with pieces that don't have armor as a stat, such as neck and trinks.  The Stam, also an upgrade.  So my opinion was that once the stats are broken down, the only loss was some attack power.  But again, since his Askmrrobot profile said it was a downgrade, and it would be replacing a piece with agility, I ended up with the piece. 

 

Anyway... sorry to go off on a rant.  Hope the information helps and we can put the debate in my guild to rest... and get on with using Robocouncil.

[Zoopercat 22]

That is odd - looking into it!

[Darkkonan 13]

I'm gonna take a shot at this...

How does Robocouncil factor upgrades?  When comparing a piece to one that is already equipped, does it include an upgrade if the currently equipped piece does?  Or.. does it just compare it to a piece as is?  On the flip side... if the currently equipped piece in the comparison is not upgraded, does the recommendation include an upgrade, or as is?

Finally... how does it come to a recommendation between two players when one player has a piece upgraded and the other player does not?  I only ask because I noticed when reviewing the example above, in the personal profile upgrade list, one was being compared to an upgraded piece and one was not.

Would any of this factor in reasoning why one piece looks like a larger upgrade on personal profile upgrade lists for a different player than the Robocouncil recommendation?

Just a stab in the dark...

[Zoopercat 22]

Darkkonan, all good thoughts. I'll have to ask our dev about what happens when one person has an upgraded item and one doesn't. That could be part of the problem.

 

However, even with that, it doesn't seem to make sense yet since the upgraded version still isn't an upgrade. If you click that gear icon in the robocouncil list, you'll see a ranked list of all of the items for that person. And it shows that items as a downgrade, so I have no idea why it's listed as an upgrade. I wonder if we're double-applying something to it.

 

Anyway, still investigating... it's a bit slow b/c we're in the middle of a big code update, but we're working on it.

[Darkkonan 13]

Appreciate you looking into it Zoopercat.  These situations are extremely rare and we still promote askmrrobot constantly, to the point where its a requirement for all our raid members to show "optimized" before raid time.  I have even placed a forum topic on our website on how to properly adjust stat weights and such for those who want the custom experience... we love it!  I'm completely confident a logical explanation will be found.. but until then, just letting my raiders know your on it means a lot, and we are still using robocouncil to help decide loot choices.