Destruction Nerf Inevitable

[Lockybalboa 618]

That would be most in line with what's been happening this expansion. It's actually viable single target and at high levels of mastery better than the other two, and Ghostcrawler seems to hate the talent.

 

Probably would be the best route to nerf it through, though, were the nerf to happen.

 

KTT is what breaks GOSac

[humphfry 0]

Yes destro is OP because it is good at whoring on adds....

Edited October 27, 2013 by humphfry

[Ilion 8]

KTT is what breaks GOSac

 

 

Why is that?

[bangorme 0]

I've got to be honest, I like it when destro warlocks aren't op.  I took six months off and came back and saw all the warlocks running around and I knew destro was strong.  That's the only time that happens.  It's a fairly easy spec to play well.  When I left there was only one active lock in my guild, when I came back there were six, all destro.

Edited October 27, 2013 by bangorme

[Perrydtf 0]

Why all the Destruction hate? Why complain about it being strong? Be happy that we have a top spec, personally I fucking hate Affliction in PvE and think its one of the most boring specs out. I much rather the playstyle of Demo/Destro. So sick of people thinking that Warlocks top spec should always be Affliction. 

[bangorme 0]

Why all the Destruction hate? Why complain about it being strong? Be happy that we have a top spec, personally I fucking hate Affliction in PvE and think its one of the most boring specs out. I much rather the playstyle of Demo/Destro. So sick of people thinking that Warlocks top spec should always be Affliction. 

I played demo before I left and liked it.  I played destro the last time it was op'd.  I'm just a little old school and remember when locks were fairly uncommon.

[Ilion 8]

Why all the Destruction hate? Why complain about it being strong? Be happy that we have a top spec, personally I fucking hate Affliction in PvE and think its one of the most boring specs out. I much rather the playstyle of Demo/Destro. So sick of people thinking that Warlocks top spec should always be Affliction. 

 

Hipster Warlocks.

[Ilion 8]

Anyway, I've been taking a look at raidbots, and destro warlock isn't better than any other class/spec combo in any fight. It works quite well on most fights, but that's it.

 

(Looking at 25 Heroic, all parses, not just top 100).

[Zagam 1,982]

Anyway, I've been taking a look at raidbots, and destro warlock isn't better than any other class/spec combo in any fight. It works quite well on most fights, but that's it.

 

(Looking at 25 Heroic, all parses, not just top 100).

25s have different flows to them, most noteably access to Shadowburn.  There are situations where you'd be used to using Shadowburn in a 10 man situation and killing an add giving you two Embers back right away.  In 25 man, that won't happen, so you end up not being able to SB spam.  Also, 25 man guilds are far fewer in volume than 10 mans, so that must be kept in mind.

 

Also, when you look at "ALL PARSES" you look at everyone, even those who died, are scrubby, or got carried hardcore.  Usually when you select top 100 parses, you remove those people while remembering you're bringing in a few outliers to the top as well.  However, the outliers to the top are usually more valuable than the outliers to the bottom, so the skewing is less.  The top 100 parses show the capacity of the spec.  Personally, I think finding the average DPS of all players playing a spec is a horrible analysis due to the overall lack of true understanding of a spec.

[Zagam 1,982]

Why all the Destruction hate? Why complain about it being strong? Be happy that we have a top spec, personally I fucking hate Affliction in PvE and think its one of the most boring specs out. I much rather the playstyle of Demo/Destro. So sick of people thinking that Warlocks top spec should always be Affliction. 

Not a lot of hate going on here, mate.  It's about being reasonable.  I didn't say we NEED a nerf, I said it should be expected and then showed mathematical proof as to why I feel that way.  No one here thinks the top spec should always be Affliction.

[Lockybalboa 618]

ALL parses are useless as it shows the bad, the dead, and the should-delete-their-toons-and-sell-their-accounts-because-their-dps-hurts-my-brain as well as the people that know what they are doing.

 

http://www.mmo-champion.com/content/?page=2

 

Half way down, the raid completed list. Even someone that does Flex Wing 1-4 has more progression than most of the people that play WoW. To me this is my boggling to know, I truly can't understand why someone would play a MMO and NOT do end game content. But I've never casually play a game in my life so that mind set is outside of my ability to understand.

 

 

Why is that?

 

 

I missed your question, sorry. The line of posts is a little far back so I'll put this refresher in, person #1) said that GoSac needed to be nerfed to bring the warlock specs in to line, person #2) said that it was our mastery/high ilvl that made GoSac so good, I stated that it was KTT that broke GoSac, Llion asked why KTT did that.

 

GoSac by itself is okay for destro, not amazing, not bad, but on par. If you take in to account that it gets rid of that ANNOY GOD DAMN PET, then it becomes very nice - but thats a personally fight by fight line of thinking.

 

What makes GoSac REALLY good is if you use KTT with it. KTT does nothing for pets, Aff a pet is ~10% of your DPS, Demo a pet is ~25% of your DPS, destro again ~10%. KTT doing almost nothing for them makes it a little on the weak side. BUT if you SAC the pet you buff your main ability AND you give your CB a DoT, all of which procs off of KTT and is buffed by KTT, thus taking GoSac from okay to AMAZING.

 

This is one of the reasons why destro is doing SO well. KTT is amazing for it and PBI is just amazing. These play well with GoSac and can do some really epic damage.

[Hurtlocker 11]

I'll probably be 'exploiting' by playing Demo.  Still going Destruction for my farm of Cho'gall residents on the Timeless Isle tonight.  Bitches beware, soon as I'm done carving my pumpkin, I'll be slaying thee.  Nothing better than one shotting two kiddies with Havoc Chaos Bolt then seeing the DoT carry over as a rage in general chat.

 

You did not say you were going to bring a warrior friend with you.  Thought you were going "stag" to the bloody coin party. 

 

I think that those that cry in general chat fail to understand that it just makes those farming coins want to do it more.

[Zagam 1,982]

You did not say you were going to bring a warrior friend with you.  Thought you were going "stag" to the bloody coin party. 

 

I think that those that cry in general chat fail to understand that it just makes those farming coins want to do it more.

Mattzo?  Mattzo is insane man.  He feeds on the tears of general chat.  I tend to kill someone and ignore them if they have the debuff because I do it PURELY for the coins (100/500 for mount, so lots more coming) but Ian, man, Ian goes BONKERS when someone rages/cries/complains.  That Warlock that was crying butthurt about how he could 1v1 me but couldn't because I wouldn't duel him just made him want to find him and obliterate him.  I tend to take a healer (my girl) with me, and Mattzo joins every time I'm out there because he loves it.  I tend to be careful for the first 10 minutes so the cooldown on my item is up, but once 10 minutes is up, we do crazy shit like take out a raid on Huolon (you're lucky I couldn't find you since you were the one that took me out) or just storm the beach's flight point until we're overwhelmed. 

 

And you're exactly right.  There's a pretty solid Rogue on our island (Puppet) who actually got my Warlock for the first time last night.  I was watching football without my GoSac up and he rocked me.  I was sad.  Know what else makes people mad?  The fact that if they didn't release, I put this in their bodies: The Flag of Ownership.  Timeless Isle is infinite in time and tears! 

 

It really is a blast...I remember who kills me.  Some Warlock whose name started with Kaos farmed my alt Monk over and over while I had the debuff, so it was pretty clear he was griefing.  Popped on the Warlock and hunted him.  He immediately went 'you have too much gear, not really fair.'  I kinda laughed when he said that.  He then inspects me and goes 'Why Mastery?' likely in regards to my gemming and reforge.  He then followed me for a good 10 minutes before finally realizing he'd get no advice from the owner of an alt he farmed.  I'm all for giving someone a coin...but if you kill my alts when they have the debuff, you will get "owned."

[Hurtlocker 11]

Mattzo?  Mattzo is insane man.  He feeds on the tears of general chat.  I tend to kill someone and ignore them if they have the debuff because I do it PURELY for the coins (100/500 for mount, so lots more coming) but Ian, man, Ian goes BONKERS when someone rages/cries/complains.  That Warlock that was crying butthurt about how he could 1v1 me but couldn't because I wouldn't duel him just made him want to find him and obliterate him.  I tend to take a healer (my girl) with me, and Mattzo joins every time I'm out there because he loves it.  I tend to be careful for the first 10 minutes so the cooldown on my item is up, but once 10 minutes is up, we do crazy shit like take out a raid on Huolon (you're lucky I couldn't find you since you were the one that took me out) or just storm the beach's flight point until we're overwhelmed. 

 

And you're exactly right.  There's a pretty solid Rogue on our island (Puppet) who actually got my Warlock for the first time last night.  I was watching football without my GoSac up and he rocked me.  I was sad.  Know what else makes people mad?  The fact that if they didn't release, I put this in their bodies: The Flag of Ownership.  Timeless Isle is infinite in time and tears!

 

Yeah, Mattzo.  I was able to get him while you guys were killing Hulon and was putting some chaos bolts into you, but you somehow escaped.  He was low though, so I was just able to shadowburn while using hulon to help with ember gen (nothing worth patting myself on the back for).  Although you guys got payback.  Kudos to your stun coordination.  Yes, I was laughing at that lock that was crying because you guys killed and wanted a 1v1.  If people really get that mad over it, I don't know why they continue playing on a pvp server.  I enjoy the whispers you get from some.  I pick up a few new mom jokes from them and thank them kindly.

Edited October 28, 2013 by Hurtlocker

[Zagam 1,982]

hahahaha...btw, you did get me.  Your CB hit me for 255k and an Immolate tick crit finished me off because Patty stupidly got in Huolon's breath and died so I lost my healer.  I was tanking Huolon and about 2 or 3 people who wanted me dead, so having no healer wasn't fun.  We weren't even in Mumble for stun coordination.  He's a Warrior...they are grossly overpowered right now.  He charges, stuns, and then I follow up with a Shadowfury if needed.  I got way ahead of him on coins because of Shadowburn.  He needs to hit Execute faster I guess.

 

I've actually rewarded people for killing me.  Usually on Sundays, I'll let everyone know I'm about to start killing people.  Whoever gets the KB on me gets gold in the amount of the # of players I've killed x100.  Some shitty DK landed a KB on me during a Huolon siege so I gave him 4500g.  He was like 'why are you giving me gold?'  I like to invoke a little challenge on the isle for me and my pocket healer.  Lightbulb is hilarious...he destroys so many kids who whine and cry.  He jumped me yesterday and paid for it dearly.  Blessing of Yu'lon for 1.1m HP and 20% more Intellect didn't help his cause. 

 

All I've got to say is if you think Cho'gall is fun, let me invite you over to Mal'Ganis for a day.  Mal'Ganis is full Horde in terms of server pop, but on the island, it looks like a 50/50 split with all the world PvP going on.  It is GLORIOUS!

[Khalam 3]

In my raid we are pretty close with ilvl but most of the fights the difference in dps is huge.

 

Immerseus - I am solo on adds so I do about 2x damage of the 2nd person.

Protectors - well im affli here ;P still doing 100k+ more dps than 2nd person

Norushen - Hard to say cause of the swithing into other realm but I am usually racing with monk (beating him by 20k usually)

Sha - 70-100k difference to 2nd person in raid (fnb immo on adds with all that extra embers and SB - purely OP)

Galakras - defending towers and using turret so I lose a lot of dps there but still in top 3 at the end

Iron - tried destro and despite all the interrupted CBs still won

Nazgrim - The longer the fight the bigger the difference between me and other people (usually 60-80k higher than 2nd person)

 

Havent done more on HC. Even on Garrosh when I havent touch adds and was like last in dps by the end of the fight I am leading by 20k+ dps.

 

Destro is OP. 4set is crazy strong. Also the difficulty of the spec is one of the lowest in game. Even if play crappy with CBs you still end up with 300k dps.

 

But we also know that there are a lot of fights were destro is meter padding. Too bad it is just weak argument :)

[Addict 0]

Might just be me freaking out - but my Chaos bolt hits for roughly 100k less than what it did 2 days ago - no added gear or changes in spec nor stats. Came here to see if there was a nerf I had missed out on.
WIll post logs after tonight's raid for comparison.
 

[Zagam 1,982]

Not touching this one with a 10ft pole. 

[Soulzar 42]

Not touching this one with a 10ft pole. 

 

Surely Blizz would never stealth nerf...right? ;)

 

I would not be shocked to see them give CB a nerf, I doubt they would adjust Immolate.  CB and Incin are running away with % of my dmg done and CB hits hard, being the most visible nerf candidate.

[Zagam 1,982]

I didn't even write that CB needed nerfed, but I did say that in our Warlock chat.  I expected CB and Immolate to be reverted or nerfed.

[Khalam 3]

I think the problem are shadowburns. Destro arent so OP in 25man.

 

Also destro has worst scaling so maybe in 3-4 weeks the ranks will change, especially on single target fights.

[Rakupenda 15]

I think the problem are shadowburns. Destro arent so OP in 25man.

 

Also destro has worst scaling so maybe in 3-4 weeks the ranks will change, especially on single target fights.

...What??

[Omaric 246]

They seem to be scaling pretty well for me.  I raid 25's and am generally the top dog.  In 25's the mobs have more health, which means more uses of SB.

[Khalam 3]

If u compare affli scaling with destro, there is a difference.

 

In 10man when there are adds fight you almost always SB finish them which gives a lot of embers. From what I heard in 25 this is more tricky.

 

If you look at raidbots the biggest differences are in 10man. Locks are a bit OP nevertheless

[Omaric 246]

The only fight that makes SB sniping more tricky in 25's is Norushen.  That's only because they have so little HP, even tuned for a 25 person raid.