Prot gear question with tier

[Cedrin 3]

I occasionally tank with my guilds second team. I have a question I can't come up with an answer for. I have a 528 helm and chest tier for a 2 set bonus. Is it worth it to drop my 553 hands and legs for possible 528 hands and legs for a 4 set? Any thoughts on this? I would link armory but logged out in ret. would 4 set lfr out way the stat lose?

[Fouton 266]

The 4set bonus is purely for self healing, and is best used with Eternal Flame. However even if you used it to its fullest potential, which is every 30 seconds with 5 stacks of Bastion, I personally don't think it's worth the giant Ilvl loss. Going from two 553s to two 528s would be a total of 3 whole Ilvl, and would cost a fair portion of haste to use. Not to mention you're probably losing around 500 strength and stamina, and some other stats.

 

Tomorrow or the day after I'll look into making a semi detailed chart based on 4set vs Ilvl depending on its usage.

[Cedrin 3]

I semi ran the math and agree that the loss is probably to great. I was looking at aomething like 20k health lose, 2% haste. That was a guess due to having different set of gear equiped and at work so can't swap it. I use eternal flame and devine purpose. Haste is at a point now to where it's hard to keep an decent uptime on ET. I may get around to trying some flex. This type of thing bugs me until I run it into the group. I haven't really had any issues tanking regular bosses even with some crappy gear.

[Fouton 266]

I've tried to run for the math for this, I'd need a simulator to be perfect due to GCDs. Basically not until your haste is pretty high, higher than my current 32.29% on my lesser paladin of 540 ilvl, just to get 5 stacks of Bastion in under 30 seconds without GC procs, which is also part of the randomness that is calculated it exactly. But essentially, the 4 set would be saving you at best 3 holy power, or ~6 seconds when out of Holy Avenger.

 

Either way, this 4set is best used with Eternal Flame and Divine Purpose, since Holy Avenger would just give you too many stacks too quickly to make it useful, since you would be overwriting Eternal Flames and then having gaps of downtime on Eternal Flame on other sections of the fight. Personally, I believe Holy Avenger is best for a very strong defensive walls, so you won't be maximizing the 4set.

 

In that case I'd say youre saving 3 holy power every 36 seconds or so, excluding GC procs. Comparing this to how much holy power haste would give you, it's actually a very strong bonus when you really think about it. You get 3s/40s of additional uptime % on your Shield of the Righteousness on average, assuming you use your self heals a lot. If you prefer to not self heal, I definitely recommend changing your opinion on the matter, however you really don't have to change what you're doing if you're doing well.

 

Basically, extrapolating some data and getting (semi inaccurate guesses) a sample of times, at 0 haste it'd take ~48 seconds to get 18 holy power (5 shields and 1 eternal flame to use it and restart the process)

 

Going from 0 to 2852 would save 3 seconds, then from 2852 to 6115 would save 3 more, then 6115 to 9884, then 9884 to 14285, then 14285 to 19495, etc. So as you can see as your haste goes up, it takes more haste to be equivalent of the 4set. Making this 4set actually very valuable... ONLY IF USED IN THIS PERFECT WORLD.

 

Normally you won't be refreshing Eternal Flame the second you get 5 stacks and have the holy power to refresh it, sometimes sit on it for more defensive situations, etc.

 

Really all I'm saying this 4set is much better than I previously imagined in terms of Haste vs 4set, however you have to remember the number of stamina, strength, and other stats that would come with it.

 

Basically it's very difficult to compare this 4set in terms of a ilvl value, and you may have to interpret it in terms of how you use Eternal Flame. Don't picture it in terms of self healing, because its actually gain in Shield of the Righteous uptime. If we were to calculate all the additions to the difference by calculating it all in terms of stat weights, it would obviously be a lot less haste requirement comparison.

 

I calculated the value of a 19 ilvl difference based on Warforged Thranok's vs Flex Thranok's and the stat weights, if all relocated in terms of haste, is 1377.5 haste = 19 gear ilvl. (Not to mention this piece of gear is one of the better itemized pieces). So really, if we were to assume 4k haste = 4set in equivalence, it would take about 55 gear ilvls. So 3.5 Character Ilevels. It's a complicated and very inaccurate guess, but atleast its a guess to go off of.

 

Getting the 4set has to be less than a 55 gear ilvl loss to obtain it. At perfect gear you'll use it cuz it doesn't cost much ilvl to do that, but when fighting between normal flex gear to determine its value, there's a general guess on how to figure that out.

[Fouton 266]

I just contacted Theck to talk to him about the 4set, and he helped out by running some SimC stuff. Basically its come down to: ALWAYS TAKE THE 4SET! ALWAYS! It's a gain of 10-12% shield uptime comparing from 553 offpieces to 528 tier, though you do lose about 7k dps. The uptime is well worth the loss in HP and avoidance overall, so I just will always recommend getting the 4set.

[Cedrin 3]

Thanks for all your time and help.  hopefully I can knock out the 4 set soon.