wow Mythic+ Season 4 Item Level Changes (Official)

[Starym 3,800]

 

We have a blue post on the item level increase coming to Mythic+ in season 4, with the numbers going to 465 for the dungeon drops themselves and 475, the equivalent of the Mythic raid, from the weekly chest!

You can check out  what we've already heard about regarding M+ in 8.3, the changes to the Quaking affix and the new seasonal affix, as well as the rewards from season 4. You can also always check out all the info on 8.3: Visions of N'zoth in our content hub as well.

M+ Reward Increase in Season 4 (source)

In Battle for Azeroth Season 4, the maximum stats on rewards from Mythic Keystone dungeons will be increasing, with item level continuing to improve up through Mythic 15. Completing a Mythic 15 dungeon in Season 4 will award item level 475 gear in the weekly chest (this is equal to Mythic raid quality), and the maximum end-of-run reward will be iLvl 465.

With this change, we seek to better calibrate rewards to the difficulty of high-end Mythic Keystone dungeons, as well as to ensure that in the absence of the random chance for Warforged/Titanforged gear in Season 4, players still have an opportunity to earn rewards from the Mythic Keystone Dungeon system that are equivalent to high-end raiding and PvP loot.

[Ragingwolf 310]

I like this alot and can't wait to start cracking again on high keys when the patch rolls through.

[Whisla 76]

Meh, I like that harder content rewards higher gear, but a big part of me doesnt like m+ keeping up with mythic raiding towards the end of a xpac. Like I dont believe the 10 affix changes a dungeon so drastically that its equivalent to learning a whole raid and managing 20 people through the content. Having the same dungeons through a whole xpac just give better and better gear to me takes the learning curve out of getting the higher gear.

[Jatuu 1]

So many people on the forums are failing to realize  that allowing dungeons to scale beyond 10 necessarily entails reducing loot quality  up to and including 10; otherwise you're going only 5 ilevels from a 10-15.  That's clearly not going to happen. 

Next season we can expect dungeon loot scaled down so that the season 4 14 is the equivalent loot to a season 3 10. At the same time, we can expect dungeon difficulty scaling up as we do every season, meaning dungeons are harder. A 14 next season will probably be the equivalent of a 17 or so. To get the same loot relative to a 10, you will have to do a 14 in season 4. If you aren't already doing 17-18, you are unlikely to do that.  There are also no apparent real power multipliers in this patch, so this means more work for the same reward, and in most cases, more work for worse loot.

Can't imagine that will be popular once people actually realize this. More chores to get to the same point. People can just barely complete 10s on average and require vastly overgearing it to do it. 

Edited November 20, 2019 by Jatuu

[Yridaa 490]

4 hours ago, Jatuu said:

People can just barely complete 10s on average and require vastly overgearing it to do it. 

Is it that bad nowadays? When I was doing Uldir on Mythic (The most recent raid at the time) before I quit playing we were already doing 10's up to 16's without breaking our necks (Still had to have coordination at that level of course). I assume they scaled up the difficulty since the loot rewards go beyond 395 ilvl but with the information you have now regarding most optimal paths and enemy abilities, things are unlikely to be that hard to complete 10s on average?

 

Did the difficulty really increase that much compared to loot rewards? I bet 380-395 gear vs 465-475 should yield about 70-80% more stats, not mentioning the additional buffs that you get nowadays and in 8.3 in terms of azerite traits/amulet/amulet powers/legendary cloak/corrupted gear. And whatever else I may have forgotten to remember.

[Jatuu 1]

3 hours ago, Yridaa said:

Is it that bad nowadays? When I was doing Uldir on Mythic (The most recent raid at the time) before I quit playing we were already doing 10's up to 16's without breaking our necks (Still had to have coordination at that level of course). I assume they scaled up the difficulty since the loot rewards go beyond 395 ilvl but with the information you have now regarding most optimal paths and enemy abilities, things are unlikely to be that hard to complete 10s on average?

 

Did the difficulty really increase that much compared to loot rewards? I bet 380-395 gear vs 465-475 should yield about 70-80% more stats, not mentioning the additional buffs that you get nowadays and in 8.3 in terms of azerite traits/amulet/amulet powers/legendary cloak/corrupted gear. And whatever else I may have forgotten to remember.

 

Yea, it is pretty bad. According to world of wargraphs, only about 10% of the population has even done a 10 across the board (keystone conqueror). More people actually have AOTC for EP and at least a couple mythic bosses.   When you read the forums, people pretend keys are easier than they are because they live in the clouds with good/overgeared groups that are the exception to the rule.  There's a very small population that does "lower keys" much less higher ones. If it were as easy as people think, we'd see quite a bit more completion of the achievement than we do. We'd also see fewer carries (since there would be no point) and less complaining about leaving. 
 

 

There are more people who have done the first few bosses of mythic or killed heroic Jaina or Queen Azshara than have done all 10s on time. 21/22% currently vs 10%.  Keystone master (15) has about 3.7% completion rate.  Slightly more than the number of people who killed Mythic Jaina. IF anything, the difficulty of Heroic raid needs to be bumped up by comparison since double the rate of people complete it vs mythic + 

 https://www.worldofwargraphs.com/global-stats/achievements/achievement-category-15271

https://www.worldofwargraphs.com/global-stats/achievements/achievement-category-15286

From season 2-3, Blizzard said they increased difficulty to the point where the community calculated it was about 3 or 4 keys difference. So if you were doing 10s, it was like you were doing 13 or 14 from season 1.  If they are scaling the loot also to stretch it out, you just gotta do more to get the same in an environment where people barely are able to time 10s. 

I'd rather m+ not drop mythic quality loot at all than make me grind through 4 more dungeons, only harder, to get the same as before, in this environment.  It's cool if you got a really good group and can ignore the *filtered*, but I don't anymore. My team that got beyond 2k all quit or went to classic. 

Edited November 20, 2019 by Jatuu

[Bobbis 208]

On 11/20/2019 at 7:24 AM, Jatuu said:

I'd rather m+ not drop mythic quality loot at all than make me grind through 4 more dungeons, only harder, to get the same as before, in this environment.  It's cool if you got a really good group and can ignore the *filtered*, but I don't anymore. My team that got beyond 2k all quit or went to classic. 

As someone who doesn't raid though, it's a blessing. I am pushing 14/15 keys now, have all above 11 in time on my main, 10 on 2 alts, working on a 3rd. I enjoy M+, and I don't have the time to commit to raiding this expac (CE in Legion and WoD though). So being able to reach the same gear levels means I can keep up with the mythic raiders. 

Equally I feel your pain, I had a good group running until classic hit... thought I'd got another but they all went horde the traitors.

I'd argue pushing a 15 is more difficult than early mythic bosses, sure it's only 5 people to manage rather than 20, but it means you can't carry anyone. I have done mythic shivara(?, 1st boss), and seen the 2nd, we only missed the 2nd because a few people are idiots with orbs, and dps was... lacking. Given that was a pug, on a Tuesday night (EU reset), with anyone above 430 being invited pretty much, I'd say we did ok. 

[Yridaa 490]

Thank you both for the insight. Yet 3-4 keys difference compared to the stats on gear and extra features vs season 1... I can understand if it's a struggle in pugs, but you shouldn't need a dedicated group to beat a +10 in time. People need to know what enemies do and interrupt/cc and use CD's during the tricky trash fights etc as has always been the case. It's a surprise to me that only 10% managed to do so. Unless they still count players like me that haven't played since S1 and since new dungeons got added, I obviously am not part of that 10%.

But I do admit, I moved on. Not to classic though. Can you imagine it? doing the final raid boss by just spamming Frostbolt for 3 minutes and nothing else? Rose tinted glasses my friend.

[Bobbis 208]

14 hours ago, Yridaa said:

Thank you both for the insight. Yet 3-4 keys difference compared to the stats on gear and extra features vs season 1... I can understand if it's a struggle in pugs, but you shouldn't need a dedicated group to beat a +10 in time. People need to know what enemies do and interrupt/cc and use CD's during the tricky trash fights etc as has always been the case. It's a surprise to me that only 10% managed to do so. Unless they still count players like me that haven't played since S1 and since new dungeons got added, I obviously am not part of that 10%.

You don't, you can pug through to +17 you just need everyone to know wth to do. I'll admit the 10% figure seems very odd, given it's fairly easy now, and anyone I know / knew that even raided to clear heroic has always pushed a +10 to get the cap and weekly chest gear. Plus you can buy a carry and get it done for like 100k gold which is hardly a lot. 

[CaperfinWoW 21]

On 11/19/2019 at 4:06 PM, Whisla said:

Meh, I like that harder content rewards higher gear, but a big part of me doesnt like m+ keeping up with mythic raiding towards the end of a xpac. Like I dont believe the 10 affix changes a dungeon so drastically that its equivalent to learning a whole raid and managing 20 people through the content. Having the same dungeons through a whole xpac just give better and better gear to me takes the learning curve out of getting the higher gear.

I agree. People who put in the effort should get awarded accordingly.