Avoidance gear is useless

[Final 1]

So dodge/parry on Protadins is next to useless, what with all the magic damage and unavoidable tank debuffs in raids.

 

Which in turn pretty much makes all prot gear useless, as it has stacks of dodge/parry on each piece.

 

So changing my loot spec to Ret is probably the best way to go as that gear has haste/mastery/crit on it, only needing to switch back to Prot if I want to try getting a new shield or something.

 

This is accurate yeah? Avoidance tanks have always been sub-optimal anyway due to bad avd streaks causing healers to have coronary's.

[Fouton 266]

That's exactly right. Ret loot spec often has a better chance to give haste gear, since prot spec has a bunch of useless stats. Dodge/Parry would be our best stat if it were only melee swings, but as you said that's not the case.

 

NOTE: This table is considering loot from the ret/prot loot roles based on a what a prot paladin wants.

 

Comparison between Ret/Prot loot specs:

Boss	Ret	Prot	Usefulness
Immerseus	Haste/Crit Chest Haste/Hit Bracers Haste/Mastery Gloves	Dodge/Parry Weapon Parry/Dodge Shoulders Dodge/Parry Bracers Haste/Hit Bracers Haste/Mastery Gloves Hit/Parry Boots	2.5/3 vs 2.5/6
Fallen Protectors	Mastery/Haste Shoulders Hit/Haste Belt Hit/Crit Ring	Mastery/Haste Shoulders Expertise/Parry Cloak Dodge/Parry Gloves Hit/Haste Belt Stam/AoE Reduc Trinket	2.5/3 vs 3/5
Norushen	Haste/Mastery Cloak* Mastery/Crit Bracers Cleave Ret Trinket	Dodge/Parry Helm Hit/Mastery Sword**	1.5*/3 vs 1**/2
Sha of Pride	Tier Chest 2H Weapon Hit/Crit Boots	Tier Chest Dodge/Parry Shield** Hit/Dodge Neck	1.5/3 vs 1.5**/3
Galakras	Haste/Mastery Helm Hit/Mastery Shoulders Strength Proc trinket	Haste/Mastery Helm Hit/Mastery Shoulders Hit/Dodge Bracers Parry/Dodge Ring	2/3 vs 2.5/4
Iron Juggernaut	Hit/Mastery Neck Expertise/Crit Bracers Crit/Haste Gloves Haste/Mastery Belt	Hit/Mastery Neck Dodge/Parry Chest Haste/Mastery Belt Dodge/Lifesteal Trinket	3/4 vs 2.5/4
Dark Shamans	Crit/Mastery Chest Hit/Mastery Belt Crit/Haste Boots Hit/Mastery Ring	Expertise/Parry Weapon** Hit/Mastery Belt Hit/Mastery Ring Hit/Dodge Ring	3/4 vs 3**/4
General Nazgrim	Tier Gloves 2H Weapon	Tier Gloves Expertise/Mastery Shield**	1/2 vs 2/2
Malkorok	Crit/Mastery Neck Crit/Mastery Legs Expertise/Mastery Boots	Expertise/Parry Bracers Expertise/Mastery Boots CD Reduc Trinket	2/3 vs 2.5/5
Spoils of Pandaria	Crit/Haste Helm Crit/Haste Ring	Parry/Mastery Shield** Mastery/Parry Belt Expertise/Dodge Boots	1/2 vs 1.5**/3
Thok	Tier Helm 2H Weapon Expertise/Mastery Ring Amplify Trinket*	Tier Helm Mastery/Parry Chest Expertise/Mastery Ring	3*/4 vs 2/3
Siegecrafter Blackfuse	Tier Shoulders Expertise/Haste Ring*	Tier Shoulders Haste/Mastery Weapon** Expertise/Parry Neck Mastery/Parry Hands	2/2 vs 3**/4
Paragons	Tier Pants Strength Trinket	Tier Pants Expertise/Crit Weapon**	1/2 vs 1.5**/2
Garrosh	Crit/Mastery Shoulder Crit/Mastery Shoulder Haste/Mastery Pants 2H Weapon BOA	Expertise/Parry Helm Haste/Mastery Pants Crit Trinket Mastery/Dodge Shield BOA	2/4 vs 2/4

* Item is RET only, even though it is a Prot worthy item.

** Item is PROT only, and no items in that slot can be obtained by Ret.

Gray = Not for prot

Red = Terrible

Yellow =  1 useful stat, 1 useless or 1stat trinket that can be reforged to 40% useful.

Green = 2 useful stats

Blue = Prot Spec only, and has 2 useful stats

 

Note: I list BoAs on Garrosh, but they cannot be coined. They're simply listed because you are given them at the kill, and the first one you get is spec related.

 

Second Note: I have Mastery as a 'Best Stat' since it's our fourth (2nd excluding hit/expertise) stat. There will be a few pieces listed Hit/Mastery in green, because it's technically a really good piece of gear, especially if you're haste capped, but you should be going Haste before reforging on every piece of gear.

[Final 1]

Thank you Fouton that is amazing. Let's hope the stat changes Blizz are going in the coming up in the next expansion make tanking gear more useful for... tanking.

[Fouton 266]

Yea, as much as I like haste for speedy GCDs, it just feels wrong.

[Astherion 4]

True, it feels wrong. I remember when I had full ToT retribution gear, I could just switch to protection, grab onehand and a shield and go tanking normal without problems.

 

If I am not mistaken, in WoD the gear is supposed to change depending on current specialization so we can only hope they will tune up the gear correctly because you won't be able to choose a gear build any more (no reforging, limited enchants and gems).

[Fouton 266]

My guess is that we will fall back onto Mastery in WoD, though I think they might buff Grand Crusader's proc rate on dodge/parry. What I hope for is a Grand Crusader proc that doesn't change but is given an ICD (this would fix prot paladins insane multi target burst), increase consecration damage/threat gen to cover the threat loss, increase dodge/party's effectiveness either in the GC proc or simply in rating per 1% avoidance. Then to make tanks not feel so pathetically slow, GCD is set to 1.2s or 1s. 

[Icepick 3]

ok so.... (not tanked since panda came out) if i wanted to update my tank gear, (i'm playing ret now),i could keep the lower cast off pieces i'm getting from ret runs and use it as a tank set?

Just add in a 1 hander and a shield with a different reforge. Is this correct?

 

M.

[Fouton 266]

Yep. Assuming your ret gear is being done: Hit/Exp to 7.5, Haste (40%) > Mastery, then you can just convert the reforging to Hit to 7.5, Expertise to 15, Haste (50%) > Mastery.

 

Infact, the DPS meta/cloak aren't bad for prot either, since one is good DPS and the other is better itemized. You lose the auto-live cloak proc, and the occasional 20% physical damage reduction, but if you don't want to spend a fortune on a new cloak/constantly regemming your helm, its no big loss.

[Icepick 3]

Very cool, cause my 2nd set (tank) is WAAAYYYY behind in levels, lol. Now i can use the "less than" drops i get in ret runs instead of taking the vendor 12 gold

[Oreoxd 165]

Fouton why is the galakras trinket under ret marked terrible? Or is that acting as if your prot? Because it's only a str proc if you're prot, and cd reduction if you're ret? YOUR CHART IS CONFUSING ME SIR

[Fouton 266]

As a tank it's purely a strength proc, so it's terrible for prot. That chart is purely for prot paladin gearing. It's basically showing what a prot paladin will get from what loot role.

[Oreoxd 165]

ok I was just a little confused by it. thanks for the clarification!