Brewmaster Monk PvE

[positiv2 953]

This thread is for comments about our Brewmaster Monk Shadowlands Guide.

[Guest Giro]

I'd suggest replacing the gloves recommendation for Stormstout's Last Keg (memory from Kaal in Sanguine Depths). This legendary as gloves is BiS, and those recommended don't even give crit

[Sinzhu 5]

4 hours ago, Guest Giro said:

I'd suggest replacing the gloves recommendation for Stormstout's Last Keg (memory from Kaal in Sanguine Depths). This legendary as gloves is BiS, and those recommended don't even give crit

Thank you for the feedback!

You are correct that creating a pair of gloves with Stormstout's Last Keg as your Legendary Power would be best for that slot, but since I am not including Legendary gear in the BiS list--they can be a little situational and honestly Charred Passions is likely to be better if we are talking about damage--I have to go with those Gloves of Haunting Fixation as the recommendation. There are two pairs of gloves that are Crit+Haste, with Gloves of Obscure Rituals having the higher Crit value of the two, but ultimately you will be using whatever of those three you can get or whatever gloves have the highest item level for you at the time.

Once the guide is updated to include items from Nathria when they are attainable, there are still unfortunately no gloves with Crit/Vers. Instead there is only another pair of Vers/Haste in the form of Bleakwing Assassin's Grips . Maybe at that time I'll include mention of the ideal Legendary slots on the page as well, though they are on the guide's Legendaries still in the meantime.

[Guest Cereaza]

Unfiltered Bone Broth needs to be moved out of the undesirable category. I don't know if the tooltip has an error or what, but from 50%, the chance went down to 38%, and on pulls where I use bonebroth with that power, it does about 80% of my overall damage. 

It is a HIGHLY desirable power, and seems overtuned if anything. 

[Sinzhu 5]

3 hours ago, Guest Cereaza said:

Unfiltered Bone Broth needs to be moved out of the undesirable category. I don't know if the tooltip has an error or what, but from 50%, the chance went down to 38%, and on pulls where I use bonebroth with that power, it does about 80% of my overall damage. 

It is a HIGHLY desirable power, and seems overtuned if anything. 

I've actually just pushed it up recently, but it hasn't yet reached the site. There definitely seems to be something fishy with its chance reduction not really adding up with what the tooltip claims, so for now I'm moving it to semi-desirable. If it doesn't get changed or "fixed" soon, I'll push it up again to highly desirable from there.

Thanks for the feedback!

[Guest heartmaker]

From my testing Corrosive Dosage does a very high amount of dps (ca. 60% of my damage on the last boss with 2 stacks.) Might want to look at that one as well, certainly does not belong in undesirable.

[Sinzhu 5]

19 hours ago, Guest heartmaker said:

From my testing Corrosive Dosage does a very high amount of dps (ca. 60% of my damage on the last boss with 2 stacks.) Might want to look at that one as well, certainly does not belong in undesirable.

Having used it myself, I can definitely agree on its potency. I'm a little hesitant to place it in strongly desired since you cannot dodge while casting it and players might get the wrong idea about using it effectively, so I'll move it to semi-desirable instead.

Thank you for posting!

[Guest Moldy Gecko]

On 12/9/2020 at 8:14 PM, Sinzhu said:

Having used it myself, I can definitely agree on its potency. I'm a little hesitant to place it in strongly desired since you cannot dodge while casting it and players might get the wrong idea about using it effectively, so I'll move it to semi-desirable instead.

Thank you for posting!

I skipped Corrosive Dosage for the first 2 weeks.  Only to pick it up and test it in the 3rd week.  It is by far "Must Grab" for any monk I know of any spec.  We still are aware we may need to dodge.  Perhaps something you could add is when combined with "Black Ox Statue" you can group all the mobs.  The only other must have over Corrosive Dosage that I can think of is the one that reflects damage back to attackers as shadow damage (as brewmaster).  Those 2 together and you're unstoppable.  

[Guest Daaz]

Only power you need is vivify. it is the only thing you need to clear this crap easily. its S+++++++ tier.

[Guest Tsingtao]

I am sorry if this should be asked in a different place. I read the Brewmaster sections on stat priority, and also the consumables/gems one. I wanted to see if you could provide a more detailed explanation as to why I should prioritize Versatility over Mastery for Brewmaster Monk, or direct me to where I can find it. I am having a bit of trouble locating it. Thank you! 

[Sinzhu 5]

On 12/29/2020 at 10:37 AM, Guest Tsingtao said:

I am sorry if this should be asked in a different place. I read the Brewmaster sections on stat priority, and also the consumables/gems one. I wanted to see if you could provide a more detailed explanation as to why I should prioritize Versatility over Mastery for Brewmaster Monk, or direct me to where I can find it. I am having a bit of trouble locating it. Thank you! 

Sorry if those sections of the guide aren't more explicit about the difference. You'll notice in the stat priority that there are two separate priorities for offense and defense. The main difference between the two is that Mastery is arguably the best stat for pure defense, but is actually the worst secondary for offense. Versatility, on the other hand, stays useful no matter what your goal is as a Brewmaster, so it is easier to recommend on the consumables page for your gem/ring enchant of choice. I could perhaps mention Mastery items instead for more defense, but that may get a little cluttered in the table or send the wrong message.

Best of luck in your tanking!

[Choobaka 0]

Another post on Corrosive dosage, sorry ?

 

So what makes Corrosive mist best for normal torghast and straight up broken for Twisting corridor :

Double dipping

https://www.wowhead.com/spell=331528/corrosive-dosage

Vivify leaves a corrosive mist around targets it heals, dealing 50% of its healing as Nature damage to nearby enemies every 1 sec for 3 sec.

Corrosive dosage has 2 parts :

- Healing done

- Damage done based on the healing done

What that means is everything that increase both healing and damage done applies 2 times instead of the usual one. For those of you who have played Path Of Exiles during the good old days, you already know that's bonkers.

Double dipping means that the more of these increase you have, the better you are. The increase in damage is not linear anymore, it's quadratic.

Exemple : You do 100 base healing with 2 corrosive dosage (100% damage). You get a 6% increase versatility anima power which (for the sake of simplicity) augment your healing and damage done by 5%. Base damage become 105, which get increased by the versatility again. Final damage : 110.25.

Since a lot of theses powers/stats are multiplicative, this get out of hand reaaaaally quickly.

So what are the double dip powers you're looking for :

- Spell power

- Versatility

- Everything that increase damage and healing that doesn't prevent nature damage.

- Critical strike : This one I'm not complete sure. Detail doesn't register critical strikes from Corrosive mist but I think it is.

Some of the power you're looking for :

- https://www.wowhead.com/spell=331528/corrosive-dosage (of course) : 5 of them is a 250% increase from the healing portion. It doesn't double dip but its the biggest increase in the base damage.

- https://www.wowhead.com/spell=294609/obleron-venom (I think that thing quadruple dip

- https://www.wowhead.com/spell=294588/obleron-spikes-x3) (if crit strike double dip)

- https://www.wowhead.com/spell=294604/obleron-ephemera-x3 for sure

- https://www.wowhead.com/spell=306571/maldraxxian-repayment

- https://www.wowhead.com/spell=319285/elethium-teardrop (if crit strike double dip)

- https://www.wowhead.com/spell=306625/cilice-of-denathrius : Pretty good on normal torghast, bonkers in twisting corridor

- https://www.wowdb.com/spells/314258-balancing-stave : Kyrian only but pretty good

- https://www.wowdb.com/spells/331667-tiger-and-crane-figurines :  So that all the stats can double dips ?. Take care to keep only the crane buff

- Probably more but Im a bit lazy ?

Most of these powers are commons in torghast and usually sold by the vendor and easily obtainable which make the build pretty much always viable.

From my experiences, on average runs run you can expect 15-40k dps on normal toghasts, and 100k-300k dps in twisting corridors.

Exemple from my last run (pretty good, got elethium-teardrop) on the last boss in twisting corridor

(yes I got Frostbite wand which I took to just to be able to touch of death mobs faster. Wasn't expecting to work on the boss but since it died in one cast of vivify ?)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 9, 2021 by Choobaka

[Sinzhu 5]

On 1/9/2021 at 9:30 AM, Choobaka said:

Corrosive Dosage etc.

You are largely correct about your corrosive dosage (CD) conclusions. It is arguably the single most reliable power you can acquire, especially for higher layers of twisting corridors. In addition, it does not have ignite or pandemic behavior--applying the buff again completely overwrites the old one and does not extend its duration or create a larger total heal. The damage itself does not crit, but if your Vivify heal was a critical strike then all of the Corrosive Dosage damage from the resulting buff will be doubled as well. However, much of its double-dipping does not actually exist, as your Versatility only increases the vivify healing (and therefore the CD healing) once rather than on both the heal and the damage afterward separately.

There's currently some wonky behavior on the power itself as it stacks as well, where it may be adding more with every copy obtained than it should. Not much more, but a little bit.

As for healing or stat increases (like the Elethium powers), so long as it doesn't specifically reduce Nature healing/damage, it's fair game for empowering your use of CD. Likewise, the Grounding Breath conduit will also increase your CD damage, as it increases Vivify healing when cast on yourself.

Finally, as you can only have one copy of the buff per friendly target, you can and should summon Dave (the black ox statue) and alternate between healing him and yourself.

 

Thank you for your continued feedback! I appreciate your compiling of some additional powers to use with it for others reading this topic and I will probably be adding a paragraph or two to the main page with further info on this Anima Power for those interested in a smooth experience ascending to layer 8 of Twisted Corridors or any of the other wings.

[Guest Brannflakes]

A more detailed explanation of how Invoke Niuzao works is sorely needed in your guide. It wasn't until recently I figured out to purify my stagger as much as possible while he's up to increase his stomp damage. After I learned that my damage output sky rocketed. Its an easily overlooked function of that ability.

[Sinzhu 5]

8 hours ago, Guest Brannflakes said:

A more detailed explanation of how Invoke Niuzao works is sorely needed in your guide. It wasn't until recently I figured out to purify my stagger as much as possible while he's up to increase his stomp damage. After I learned that my damage output sky rocketed. Its an easily overlooked function of that ability.

That aspect of Niuzao is mentioned in the Spell Summary, but you are right that it could probably do with an additional mention in the rotation section next to Fortifying Brew and Zen Meditation. I'll see what I can do.

Thank you!

[d4t4king 0]

On the Easy Mode page of the guide, you recommend Healing Elixir in the 35 level and Bob and Weave in the 40 level.  They are both in the same level (40).

[Sinzhu 5]

On 3/12/2021 at 5:18 PM, d4t4king said:

On the Easy Mode page of the guide, you recommend Healing Elixir in the 35 level and Bob and Weave in the 40 level.  They are both in the same level (40).

Looks like I changed the wrong row on accident during 9.0.5 updates. Sorry about that; it will be fixed shortly. Thank you for pointing it out!

[Raffinaddi 18]

Shaohao's Might STILL isn't good enough, despite a... over 300 % buff? or something like that?

[Sinzhu 5]

On 3/22/2021 at 9:29 AM, Kakistocrat said:

Shaohao's Might STILL isn't good enough, despite a... over 300 % buff? or something like that?

Unfortunately, yes. In damage it stands no chance against Charred Passions or Stormstout's Last Keg, even in single target where it stands the best odds of competing. In defense it can sort of keep up with Stormstout's in single-target where you are able to use Tiger Palm more.

To look at it another way:

Tiger Palm hits for ~27% Attack Power compared to Keg Smash's ~86%. Even when Shaohao's Might activates, Tiger Palm still does not hit as hard as Keg Smash  while also only hitting one target. Its extra Brew reduction also only averages out to .8s per cast. As such, it really cannot be argued over Stormstout's for either purpose and especially not over Charred Passions for raw damage. If Blackout Combo were a viable talent it would have more of a chance to succeed, but a 4-second Blackout Kick is just too long for it as well.

[Guest Malchova]

I noticed in the Brewmaster Covenent section that it states that for Party Favors  you only get it for four hours per day. This is incorrect as the buff lasts four hours yet can be applied/reset every time you drink the tea - which is on a one hour cooldown. It's possible to always have this buff applied, though with random stats.

[Sinzhu 5]

On 10/14/2021 at 9:58 AM, Guest Malchova said:

I noticed in the Brewmaster Covenent section that it states that for Party Favors  you only get it for four hours per day. This is incorrect as the buff lasts four hours yet can be applied/reset every time you drink the tea - which is on a one hour cooldown. It's possible to always have this buff applied, though with random stats.

Ah yes, that must have been a vestige of an older iteration of the tea. Given the general lack of Venthyr Brewmasters, it doesn't surprise me that it has taken this long for someone to find an error there. I'll be sure to correct it immediately.

Thank you for finding this!

[Guest Peter]

I would definitely reconsider your recommendation of talent choice. Every serious brm plays special delivery now. Its dmg is immense and combined with CI lego and necro you become a new tank in terms of durability. It is 100 times superior to kyrian and stormstout (even almost from an output perspective).

[Sinzhu 5]

14 hours ago, Guest Peter said:

I would definitely reconsider your recommendation of talent choice. Every serious brm plays special delivery now. Its dmg is immense and combined with CI lego and necro you become a new tank in terms of durability. It is 100 times superior to kyrian and stormstout (even almost from an output perspective).

I'm not so sure where you're drawing the line at "serious" here. If we're in a Mythic raid environment then any "serious" Brewmaster there is still solidly a Kyrian, Stormstouts, and Rushing Jade Wind user. In Mythic+, things get more murky when most people tend to base their opinions on what the highest raider.io players are using even when the meta at that level is vastly different from what's necessary at even keys around the level of +24 (which itself is still vastly above what 99% of the player population will experience).

With that being said, you are correct that Special Delivery in combination with the Celestial Infusion/Mighty Pour Legendary has become far more popular at the highest end of Mythic+, though in order to exceed the damage of Stormstouts and Rushing Jade Wind you both need to play well with your Purifying Brew charges and face more than 5 targets at a time. You also will be giving up the additional "snap threat" on pull by not being able to throw two Keg Smashes back to back and not having the continuous AoE threat generated from your always-on Rushing Jade Wind. This talent and Legendary are definitely more viable than either have been at any point in Shadowlands (and even since patch 7.2.5 in the case of Special Delivery), which was reflected in Special Delivery's recommendation being bumped up to situational this patch.

I may yet increase Special Delivery to a generally recommended talent (or more likely just do so on the Mythic+ page) along with rewording its description to not be so against the option, but I am still leery of more than situationally recommending Mighty Pour/Celestial Infusion for all but the most hardcore of players who can likely decide for themselves where they want to use it.

Hopefully I explained my thought process well enough, and thank you for the feedback!

[magicman 0]

Hello,  

Love the guide its really great!!  I just wanted to make one small comment about the trinkets section.   In the section where you compared differences between the two cheat-death style trinkets, you stated that Weave of Warped Fates differs from Splintered Heart of Al'ar in that the Weave's cooldown isn't reset when you die after its effect has been activated, while the Splintered Heart's cooldown does reset when you die after it has procced.   

However I have tested this and it is not true.  Both of these trinkets work exactly the same way, and both of their CDs will be reset when you die after they have procced.  Also they both have separate cooldowns (i.e. do not share a cooldown) and therefore can both be worn at the same time.   The only real difference, at equal item level, is that the Splintered Heart heals you for about 35% less than the Weave does when it procs, in exchange for doing a chunk of damage to all targets in a short range around your character, friend or foe.  

Thank you again for the excellent guide! 

[Sinzhu 5]

On 8/23/2022 at 9:44 PM, magicman said:

Hello,  

Love the guide its really great!!  I just wanted to make one small comment about the trinkets section.   In the section where you compared differences between the two cheat-death style trinkets, you stated that Weave of Warped Fates differs from Splintered Heart of Al'ar in that the Weave's cooldown isn't reset when you die after its effect has been activated, while the Splintered Heart's cooldown does reset when you die after it has procced.   

However I have tested this and it is not true.  Both of these trinkets work exactly the same way, and both of their CDs will be reset when you die after they have procced.  Also they both have separate cooldowns (i.e. do not share a cooldown) and therefore can both be worn at the same time.   The only real difference, at equal item level, is that the Splintered Heart heals you for about 35% less than the Weave does when it procs, in exchange for doing a chunk of damage to all targets in a short range around your character, friend or foe.  

Thank you again for the excellent guide! 

Thanks for the feedback! The behavior being referenced there was changed when Weave was made into a more traditional cheat death trinket instead of its weird "you must be killed with no more than X damage of overkill". As for both resetting upon death, I'm not too sure who would dare wear double cheat death trinkets either, but you are correct!

I'll make an adjustment to reflect the updated debuff behavior on Weave; thanks again