Mistweaver Monk PvE

[positiv2 953]

This thread is for comments about our Mistweaver Monk Shadowlands Guide.

[Tequima 2]

On the Easy Mode guide it mentions prioritising Leech or any iLevel 10-15 more except rings then refers to this article "for more detail"... but there isn't any on this area.

Is this still true in SL?

[Dhaubbs 6]

On 10/17/2020 at 3:03 AM, Tequima said:

On the Easy Mode guide it mentions prioritising Leech or any iLevel 10-15 more except rings then refers to this article "for more detail"... but there isn't any on this area.

Is this still true in SL?

Good catch brother, leech was sort of left out of the stats guide (it was more referring to the end where we link to to sims and stat weights) - yes this is still true for SL, you'll want to prioritize ilvl over anything generally. However, you'll wanna use WoWA and QElive in order to get your true weights

*edit* Just wrote up an explanation of tertiaries, so once that gets approved it'll be pushed to the live site - thanks again

[Guest Bungo]

You've got the jade serpant statue lasts 30 seconds but this has been reduced to 8 I'm pretty sure?

[Dhaubbs 6]

On 11/7/2020 at 2:42 AM, Guest Bungo said:

You've got the jade serpant statue lasts 30 seconds but this has been reduced to 8 I'm pretty sure?

You're correct, its 8 seconds now. I thought I changed the duration on all my pages, but it looks like one slipped through lol. If you find any more don't hesitate to let me know

[Guest Marf]

For the anima powers in Torghast, can they please be sorted alphabetically within the tiers.

[Guest Nokster]

Unfiltered Bone Broth is listed as B tier, but the proc rate is way higher than the 3% claimed by the tooltip (usually it goes from about 50% to 25% or so), and will often be 60% damage on any fights you use it, including bosses. Is the 'B' rating based on the 3% rate given by the anima power tooltip, or actual proc rate? Because the power as implemented seems way stronger than a 'B' rating.

[Dhaubbs 6]

25 minutes ago, Guest Nokster said:

Unfiltered Bone Broth is listed as B tier, but the proc rate is way higher than the 3% claimed by the tooltip (usually it goes from about 50% to 25% or so), and will often be 60% damage on any fights you use it, including bosses. Is the 'B' rating based on the 3% rate given by the anima power tooltip, or actual proc rate? Because the power as implemented seems way stronger than a 'B' rating.

Hey! The B rating was because I had assumed the proc rate was bugged on beta, I too was seeing it proc way WAY more than 3% of the time. I just chalked it up to the myriad of bugs we had, and assumed when live hit, it would be fixed like all the other powers. So now it seems unclear if that's intentional or not. For the time being I'll bump that sucker up to S tier. Thanks for keeping an eye out, I didn't go  Necrolord so I haven't been able to see the other Cov powers.

[Guest Sombrero]

Hi. There is an error on the Gear and BiS page in the Dungeon BiS list. The listed boots are Mail not Leather. The correct item is Viscera-Stitched Footpads from Blightbone in The Necrotic Wake .

[Dhaubbs 6]

On 12/19/2020 at 1:38 PM, Guest Sombrero said:

Hi. There is an error on the Gear and BiS page in the Dungeon BiS list. The listed boots are Mail not Leather. The correct item is Viscera-Stitched Footpads from Blightbone in The Necrotic Wake .

Huh. Not sure how that even happened lol. Thanks for the heads up, the change will go through just as soon as the editors clear it

[Guest Asalya]

Either I am getting terrible disc priests consistently or this rating for them is far too high. Also, MW Monks seem to be VERY strong but are rated lower than a disc for mythic +. Not really agreeing with the guide at all.  Has anyone else experienced the same? Every time I bring a disc to mythic plus they cannot keep up the with hps output required. My MW (at the same gear level) can easily handle the healing without having any mana issues. Defensive wise MW have diffuse magic/dampen harm and fort brew. Their mobility alone makes them extremely unlikely to get hit by a mechanic and they have revival plus the new cd and life cocoon. Your ranking states that they only have life cocoon. Also, they bring mystic touch which increases physical damage dealt by the whole party and a large stun (leg sweep) to help with interrupts on stunnable mobs. They also have a 1 minute hard cc (paralysis) to use to cc the freeze tag, slimes, or even parts of trash if needed. Why do you only have them at a B ranking?

[Guest squess]

There's a little typo in the 3rd paragraph of section "2.2.2. Avoidance" in the description of the Tomb of Sargeras raid. Ty for the guide! 

[Guest Guest]

Hello,

Thanks for the guide.

I found a typo.

2.2.1. Leech - Missing a c from can. "But when you get your next upgrade it an be tricky to know if you ought to not equip something of a higher item level just because your old gear has Leech on it."

Feel free to delete this comment once resolved.

[Natalia 20]

21 hours ago, Guest Guest said:

Hello,

Thanks for the guide.

I found a typo.

2.2.1. Leech - Missing a c from can. "But when you get your next upgrade it an be tricky to know if you ought to not equip something of a higher item level just because your old gear has Leech on it."

Feel free to delete this comment once resolved.

Thank you for flagging this. We will fix that.

[Guest Ilgor]

Hello! For https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/mistweaver-monk-pve-healing-gear-best-in-slot , the 3.2 part, raid gearing, only shows one trinket recommandation. What's trinket 2 ?

Feel free to delete this comment once resolved.

[Dhaubbs 6]

On 3/31/2021 at 11:58 AM, Guest Ilgor said:

Hello! For https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/mistweaver-monk-pve-healing-gear-best-in-slot , the 3.2 part, raid gearing, only shows one trinket recommandation. What's trinket 2 ?

Feel free to delete this comment once resolved.

Hello! So the Cabalist's Hymnal is the only best in slot trinket out of Nathria with Manabound Mirror being second, only by virtue of it's item level.  Your goal should ideally be to get a Soulletting Ruby, or Unbound Changeling from your vault  for your second trinket.  A Sinful Gladiators Badge of Ferocity is also a good choice if you PvP.  For reference, a 233 Mirror is basically the same hps as a 226 Soulleting Ruby.

For a more precise answer, if you head over to our Simulations page there's a link to a tool developed by a player named Voulk called QELive. It'll let you input your character and check gear for upgrades, as well as having a deeper break down of how the trinkets will stack up at different ilvls specifically for your character.

[Wyr3d 1]

Heads up, but both Mistweaving, and Fistweaving have the same stat priorites now. Actually, they had the same last time too, but I forgot to mention it. These this probably be condensed down into "Normal" a "Mythic Dungeon" specs 

Oddly you've already done this for Easy Mode section  - although the stats for Mythic are different..

Edited July 1, 2021 by Wyr3d

[Dhaubbs 6]

On 7/1/2021 at 6:32 AM, Wyr3d said:

Heads up, but both Mistweaving, and Fistweaving have the same stat priorites now. Actually, they had the same last time too, but I forgot to mention it. These this probably be condensed down into "Normal" a "Mythic Dungeon" specs 

Oddly you've already done this for Easy Mode section  - although the stats for Mythic are different..

I'm sorry, I'm not sure what you're commenting on or wanted changed here, could you clarify?  I'll try to reply but if I've misinterpreted you, please let me know.

Mistweaving and Fistweaving  generally do have the same stat priorities when listed in order, but the proportions will change based on which you're doing. As for labeling, I prefer to not classify Fistweaving by what content it's doing, and rather by the playstyle; reason being is that Fistweaving isn't actually good for Mythic+ once the key level starts to reach a certain point, and giving people the idea that X playstyle is meant for y content can set expectations in a poor place.

[Wyr3d 1]

My apologies if my comment wasn't direct enough. For the purposes of my add-on, I use the basic information given for statisitics.

Since the priorities were the same for both these playstyles (Mistweaving, and Fistweaving) there is no need to have seperate listings for each for the spec. Mythic+ still has a different stat priority, so these were listed as "Normal" (to represent Mistweaving and Fistweaving) and "Dungeon" (for Mythic+)

[Guest Pete]

I do not understand the value being placed on the soulbind trait Token of Appreciation for the Soulbind Theotar concerning Venthyr Mistweavers. They way it is talked about seems to imply passive shielding on our healing targets while the text clearly states that it grants an absorb to allies who aid us with healing or beneficial effects. This may have some value in raids where other healers heal us or the odd warrior Rallying Shout but most value will come from the potency slot down that path, not the trait.

[Dhaubbs 6]

On 9/3/2021 at 4:19 AM, Guest Pete said:

I do not understand the value being placed on the soulbind trait Token of Appreciation for the Soulbind Theotar concerning Venthyr Mistweavers. They way it is talked about seems to imply passive shielding on our healing targets while the text clearly states that it grants an absorb to allies who aid us with healing or beneficial effects. This may have some value in raids where other healers heal us or the odd warrior Rallying Shout but most value will come from the potency slot down that path, not the trait.

You are absolutely correct! A lot of the value of Token of Appreciation comes from the fact that it enables a potency slot.  However, even without the potency slot, Token absolutely blows the other options out of the water.  If you check most logs, Token represents about a 3-4% throughput increase, where as the alternative of Wasteland Propriety is around a 1% increase personally.  Now, one could make pretty cogent argument about the benefit of increasing the versatility of your fellow raiders while taking a personal HPS hit and allowing your fellow healers to absorb that. However, I personally don't think that a minor damage buff to your fellow raiders would be more beneficial than the shielding you would lose.

Quote

They way it is talked about seems to imply passive shielding on our healing targets while the text clearly states that it grants an absorb to allies who aid us with healing or beneficial effects.

Could you point me specifically to where that is implied?  If that's the case, I need to edit the guide to make it more clear, but I'm just not seeing it.  

[Dhaubbs 6]

On 8/11/2021 at 2:01 AM, Wyr3d said:

My apologies if my comment wasn't direct enough. For the purposes of my add-on, I use the basic information given for statisitics.

Since the priorities were the same for both these playstyles (Mistweaving, and Fistweaving) there is no need to have seperate listings for each for the spec. Mythic+ still has a different stat priority, so these were listed as "Normal" (to represent Mistweaving and Fistweaving) and "Dungeon" (for Mythic+)

Ahhhh okay, so you're using pawn, I understand.  When I say they're "the same" I mean generally.  If you want to get so specific that you're assigning numerical values to each stat, then you can use more specific tools like QElive.

[Wyr3d 1]

Um, nope never heard of "Pawn."

When I said "my addon" I literally mean, "my addon". It's just a little tool that pops up with a little window above the paperdoll when you check your character's sheet. This displays the general stat priorites the class/spec should aim for when upgrading, based on the information here given at Icy Veins. Its designed for people who are new to the game, those with a lot of alts (like myself) and those who are either trying out a new class, or are casual about theit gameplay, but still want ot make the best choices for their character.

The add-on is for on the fly upgrades, and so on. For more in depth knowledge on the class/spec priorities, and other functionality of their chosen character class and spec, players are directed to the website, of course. I guess with Classic, and Classic TBC it's more my addon's" now though. If you care to check them out:

           Retail Version                                               Classic Version                                                  Classic TBC Version

Edited September 16, 2021 by Wyr3d

[MorriganGrey 0]

"Sadly, in spite of the fact that Mythic+ can scale into the hardest content in the game, Blizzard refuses to reward the upper echelons of that content in any way. As such, in order to obtain best-in-slot gear for Mythic+, you are required to raid. Check out our gearing page for more information."

This false statement doesn't add anything to the guide except to communicate that the author doesn't like raiding. Statements like this only serve to exacerbate the tensions between M+ players and raiders.

The gearing page has separate BiS lists for dungeon and raid and offers no hint as to which best-in-slot raid gear the author could be referring to. Since heroic raid gear is iLvl 239 and M+ gear upgrades to 246 with 252 from the GV, and the best healing trinkets are from M+, it's a bewildering statement. Perhaps the author is referring to mythic raid gear, but I doubt CE raiders are the target audience.

The guide would be improved if the author were to remove the biased remark and edit the BiS guide to make it clear which best-in-slot items come from raiding vs. M+. I suspect with a well structured evaluation the author will realize that outside of mythic raid, the better gear comes from M+ this season.

[Dhaubbs 6]

On 12/4/2021 at 3:33 PM, MorriganGrey said:

"Sadly, in spite of the fact that Mythic+ can scale into the hardest content in the game, Blizzard refuses to reward the upper echelons of that content in any way. As such, in order to obtain best-in-slot gear for Mythic+, you are required to raid. Check out our gearing page for more information."

This false statement doesn't add anything to the guide except to communicate that the author doesn't like raiding. Statements like this only serve to exacerbate the tensions between M+ players and raiders.

The gearing page has separate BiS lists for dungeon and raid and offers no hint as to which best-in-slot raid gear the author could be referring to. Since heroic raid gear is iLvl 239 and M+ gear upgrades to 246 with 252 from the GV, and the best healing trinkets are from M+, it's a bewildering statement. Perhaps the author is referring to mythic raid gear, but I doubt CE raiders are the target audience.

The guide would be improved if the author were to remove the biased remark and edit the BiS guide to make it clear which best-in-slot items come from raiding vs. M+. I suspect with a well structured evaluation the author will realize that outside of mythic raid, the better gear comes from M+ this season.

First off, it's not false.  Objectively, due to the nature of how M+ can scale and raids cannot, it's true that M+ can scale into the hardest content in the game.  This inclusion, however, was meant as an olive branch to people who prefer M+, coming from someone who exclusively enjoys raiding.  I really do not enjoy M+.  It's simply a means to an end for me.  Given the option, I wouldn't do it at all.  The fact that you took this one sentence out of my whole guide (which is fairly skewed towards raiding), to mean that I somehow don't enjoy raiding is a little frustrating.  It's disheartening that you've (ironically enough) tried to warp my recognition of Blizzard's delegitimizing of M+'s content reward structure, as some sort of divisive tactic instead of the throw-away, bridge building comment it was intended to be.  The idea that M+ players are somehow "lesser than" when compared to raiders is not new, and it's one that has plagued the top end M+ players basically since its inception.  For too long, raiders haven't needed to run M+ in order to raid, but M+ players have needed to raid in order to be competitive.  Thankfully, Blizzard is attempting to ameliorate this situation by making the new tier sets attainable from sources other than raids.

All I'm saying is that us raiders need to respect the hustle and hard work that M+ players put in, and we ought to be thankful that Blizzard is trying to solve their gearing problem.  We're all on the same side here.

As for the BiS lists, all I'm telling you is what the ideal items are that drop from a particular set of content.  I also make it very clear that if you want more detailed and personalized answers, you need to check out the tools that will give you said answers, such as QElive and WoWA.  This isn't TBC classic, where there's 1 version of every item, and you can just get a perfect BiS in a week.  Stat weights are complicated and depend heavily on your current gear and performance.  A "BiS" item that I've listed, might not actually be better than some other item you're using at particular item levels.  This is actually why I really dislike the idea of BiS lists at all in modern WoW, but as a quick point of reference they can be somewhat helpful.  However, it is very important to use said lists as just one point in the totality of the data you have available to you.  It's why you so often hear DPS players bark out the phrase "just sim it!" 😛

Anyway, I hope this response has at least shed some light on my thought process - if you have any further questions or concerns, feel free to leave them below.