Should I add Rain of Fire to my single target rotation?

[Nyanchan 2]

I was wondering at how much haste rain of fire becomes a dps increase when added to the rotation. If i remember correctly it was mentioned that it was useful when i had my Meta gem proc (because of the increased haste). But I am sitting now at 15805 unbuffed haste (37.19%). Should I just make use of rain of fire now when on single target if i have nothing better to use other than incinerate?

[Orthios 271]

From Zagam's destro guide:

 

 

9) Rain of Fire & Fire and Brimstone

 

Destruction's AoE is very powerful.

 

Rain of Fire is a ground targetted AoE spell that does Fire damage over time and has a low chance to generate Burning Embers. Rain of Fire should always be applied when 2 or more targets will be hit by it. Rain of Fire should be applied to one target when that target will stand in Rain of Fire for the full duration and you have some Haste proc such as Bloodlust, Berserking, or Tempus Repit.

 

 

[Lockybalboa 618]

That is a LOT of haste. Like 3k more then I would ever say anyone should go. Just saying. Even with that ludicrous amount of haste you should still only cast it with a haste buff like the ones listed.

[Nyanchan 2]

 

From Zagam's destro guide:

 

 

lol what? 

 

That is a LOT of haste. Like 3k more then I would ever say anyone should go. Just saying. Even with that ludicrous amount of haste you should still only cast it with a haste buff like the ones listed.

 

Yeah but I have been following the reforge Mastery > Haste > Crit style. My haste suddenly bumped after getting BBoY (even after reforging to mastery). And amr also suggest the same reforge values... 

 

Do you think i should reforge out of haste? It is just that haste is so pretty... 

 

But still take berserking for example which is 20% haste, with raid buffs and all of that I would totally have around the same haste as someone with lower gear but that just popped berserking, maybe? Which is why there would come a point in were you would have enough haste to add rof to the rotation.

 

I only have 5.8k crit tho, maybe thats an issue

 

here is my armory: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/frostmourne/nyanchan/simple

[Lockybalboa 618]

I don't bather dropping RoF with haste procs because the DPS gain is so low that I just care much. I only drop it on multi target. That said, in order to get enough haste where you would put it in to the base rotation you would be MASSIVELY over GCD cap.

 

Zag, Kaz, and I were talking about haste just now in mumble during raid. Zag sits AT destro haste cap of 14.6k haste. Right now we're having a weird week so we don't have spell haste buff in the raid, so Zag has a 1.09 sec Incinerate cast with trollZerk and LMG. With spell haste it drops to around .8 second. He has this much haste because he likes it and because its what he needs for demo with no reforging.

 

14.6k is haste cap. Past that you REALLY don't get much from haste. You're more then 1k over that right now. By the time you get to a haste point that RoF would be a ember gain you would be at or near GCD with no haste procs.

[Lockybalboa 618]

But still take berserking for example which is 20% haste, with raid buffs and all of that I would totally have around the same haste as someone with lower gear but that just popped berserking, maybe? 

 

 

Not sure I understand what you're trying to say. It doesn't matter if you have a 580 ilvl and 15k haste or a 500 ilvl and 15k haste. It still is going to be effected by procs the same and would still GCD cap the same.

[Nyanchan 2]

Not sure I understand what you're trying to say. It doesn't matter if you have a 580 ilvl and 15k haste or a 500 ilvl and 15k haste. It still is going to be effected by procs the same and would still GCD cap the same.

 

oh, what i meant here is, 580 ilvl and 15k haste, would be similar to 500 ilvl 6k haste + berserking.  (not real numbers just guessing)

 

 

So 14.6k haste is what i should be Aiming for? and reforge the rest to crit? (where can i find the exact number so that i can add it to a.m.r.)

 

Thanks

 

PD: This is because i liked the tot play style more than the current soo one...

[Lockybalboa 618]

Zag might know the exact numbers but 14.6k is close enough. +/- 99 rating won't matter. If you're doing this for playstyle then do whatever you want really, over haste cap is a DPS loss but not a huge one. Unless you go crazy and run your haste up to like 20k, then you would feel the dps loss.

 

The loss isn't as much from GCD capping as from the loss of stats in to useful things, like crit.

[Nyanchan 2]

Oh okay thanks, ill try to find the haste needed to fit a chaos bolt and an immolate on a 4p proc. TYVM

[Elro 47]

I run 16k haste, but that's because I play Demo 99% of the time. Even when I go Destro, I don't use RoF on single target with my LMG proc. It's just not enough of a gain, and I don't like it.

[Zagam 1,982]

RoF isn't ever used in my rotation, even with LMG up.  Too busy snapshotting every single 4pc proc with Immo, Chaos Bolt, or trying to squeeze in as many abilities as possible.  I use RoF for ember generation, and that's only going to happen when it's hitting multiple targets.

 

As for Haste, high Haste penalizes Destruction unless you're absolutely perfect on utilizing your fast cast speeds.  Crit and Haste are equal for Destruction up until you start bumping into waiting for GCDs.  This happens to me at my Haste rating just shy of 15k WITHOUT spell haste buff.  With it, I GCD cap a lot in my opener - but I don't care because content is on farm, I enjoy going back to Demo sometimes, and I don't like reforging - so I just allow myself to GCD cap in the opener, which is really ok to me.  For those who NEED to min/max, I wouldn't suggest doing this. 

 

The caveot to all of this is I am able to utilize my Haste to do certain things.  For one, I know EXACTLY when to cast Chaos Bolt for that elusive 10 stack BBoY.  With my amount of Haste, I can get 3 Chaos Bolts off during BBoY - 1 at 6 stacks, 1 at 8 stacks, and 1 at 10 stacks.  I can also utilize Ember Master and get two Chaos Bolts off during this buff instead of just one.  With some good timing, I can get two Chaos Bolts and snapshot an Immolate in there just for good measure. 

 

To summarize - Destruction has a low, easily obtainable Haste ceiling - hitting it is bad unless you just don't care and can fully utilize your Burning Embers with Haste throughout the entire fight.

[Liquidsteel 279]

Also remember that the main culprit of GCD capping is Backdraft.

 

When I played at high haste destro (14-15k), I would make a conscious effort to limit conflagrate casts when my Meta Gem was up to avoid wastage.

 

Haste is still good, as it speeds up the rest of your gameplay (like Zagam said), not just with Chaos Bolt, but also with your regular, non backdrafted incinerates.

[Zagam 1,982]

No Conflag in opener for me had a bad effect - I went OOM - super fast Incinerates without mana cost reduction hurts.  I agree with not using it while TR is up, but in the opener, it really can't be avoided if you're trying to build Embers for powered up CBs.

[Nyanchan 2]

Im completely lost with what to reforge, comfortably with high haste but i noticed my stuff doesnt hit as hard as i can, then i tried to reforge haste out of a couple of pieces and now it feels slow, plus it became really hard to time bboy and the 4p, so now im back to 15k ish but i still think something is wrong with my reforging...

 

 

Plus i dont understand the opener either, just incinerate until i get 3 embers and launch them? (since bboy will be at around 5?) the haste issue changed when i got bboy i got completely used to how i was playing with ktt....

[Zagam 1,982]

Your reforge has a very minor effect on your DPS.  Please do not think that moving around Haste or Crit will suddenly "fix" your DPS.

 

Your stat reforge and opener are mutually exclusive. 

[Zagam 1,982]

the haste issue changed when i got bboy i got completely used to how i was playing with ktt....

Just go back to what you're comfortable with.  KTT will outperform BBoY unless you COMPLETELY master how to use BBoY.  It sounds like you have some room to grow in that department, so play comfortably and work on building comfort with BBoY on test dummies and things.

[Liquidsteel 279]

Should have clarified, my opener remains the same in terms of using double conflag, but if I got a meta proc later in the fight, id try and only use conflag if it was close to capping on 2 charges.

[Cardio33 3]

I don't bather dropping RoF with haste procs because the DPS gain is so low that I just care much. I only drop it on multi target. That said, in order to get enough haste where you would put it in to the base rotation you would be MASSIVELY over GCD cap.

 

Zag, Kaz, and I were talking about haste just now in mumble during raid. Zag sits AT destro haste cap of 14.6k haste. Right now we're having a weird week so we don't have spell haste buff in the raid, so Zag has a 1.09 sec Incinerate cast with trollZerk and LMG. With spell haste it drops to around .8 second. He has this much haste because he likes it and because its what he needs for demo with no reforging.

 

14.6k is haste cap. Past that you REALLY don't get much from haste. You're more then 1k over that right now. By the time you get to a haste point that RoF would be a ember gain you would be at or near GCD with no haste procs.

What is the 14.6k haste cap you are talking about?  I'm assuming you mean when backdraft gives a 1 sec incinerate cast which is at 35% haste unbuffed correct?

[Zagam 1,982]

What is the 14.6k haste cap you are talking about?  I'm assuming you mean when backdraft gives a 1 sec incinerate cast which is at 35% haste unbuffed correct?

Yes.  I'm a little over it, but I don't really care to fine tune my secondary stats because 1) it wastes gold and 2) it doesn't really matter.

[JvChequer 43]

U guys have a lot of Haste, I got around 11,5k and feels pretty much fine.

[Zagam 1,982]

U guys have a lot of Haste, I got around 11,5k and feels pretty much fine.

Good thing it doesn't matter! 

 

(Hint to the newbies: It really doesn't - it's a choice of playstyle.)