wow Dragonflight Group Loot and BoE Clarifications

[Staff 1,488]

Blizzard have added many clarifications to the loot system coming with Dragonflight, specifically focusing on Group Loot and clarifying that weapons will most likely will not be BoE drops.

Raid Loot (Source)

Hey folks, going to respond to add some clarity that might alleviate some concerns, or at the very least better communicate how things will be.

As the title says, these would be for Dragonflight Season 1 - which means the Group Loot being always on is not just for beta. That said, we’ve improved Group Loot a lot from when it was last shown in 2016, and are continuing to work to remove other edge cases. For example:

• In the past, Need/Greed only knew if something was equippable or the right armor type, not if it was meant for your spec or not. This is now changed.
• First off, you can never Need for anything your class cannot wear. No warriors sniping cloth robes with a need roll and giving it away or trolling.
• We also have mainspec and offspec functionality built-in, which changes based on the current loot spec you set.
• Main spec takes priority, then Off spec, then greed. So while a Ret paladin can’t off-spec loot a shield away from a main-spec roll from the Tank, anyone rolling greed could never win it over them. This also means that if you swap specs for a specific fight, like going Holy, you can still main spec roll for your desired items if they come from that boss without having to worry about hurting yourself by being flexible to your group.
• Players won’t be able to win multiples of the same item - say that 2 sets of Shoulders drop. While you can roll Need on both of them, winning one will ‘remove’ your roll from the other.
• Additionally, players can’t Need on a piece of loot if they’re wearing the exact piece at the exact item level, though in the event where this occurs but the dropped piece has a Tertiary stat or Socket, that roll would be possible (as those are upgrades).
• Lastly, even after winning the roll, items remain fully tradeable without restrictions to any player that was eligible as a looter - as-in, if you weren’t locked to that boss previously. Inversely, this means that players who have already killed Boss 1 on Normal for the week can’t join for that boss and have loot traded to them (similarly, the need/greed pane won’t appear for that player).

As many in this thread have speculated, all players in Personal Loot were constantly ‘rolling’ behind the scenes, whether you wanted to or not. It’s not as simple as ‘with group loot you’re rolling against everyone, but in personal loot you’re rolling against fewer’. Changing to Group Loot for raids makes the process of loot acquisition and distribution more transparent and gives players more freedom to trade loot around and allocate it socially if they choose to do so.

Additionally, the current plan is for Group Loot to be active in Looking for Raid, though we’re open to taking action such as increasing the quantity of loot from LFR if the friction proves to be too much there.

On the Topic of BoEs:

Based on feedback and some further consideration, we’re likely not moving forward with Weapons as part of a BoE table just yet. It’s very possible that introducing that level of volatility would make it hard to us to verify how the other BoE changes are working (and if we’d like to support them). It’s on the table for future iteration, but might cause too much unintended chaos at the start of a period of so much systemic change for WoW as a whole.

Thanks for all your feedback thus far, and we hope this at least better clarifies how we envision this working in the near future.

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I am presuming for weapons for specs that can duel weild and say x boss drops your bis and you want 2 of the same weapon you can still roll for your second slot even if you have one equipped?

That’s correct, dual wielding classes are exempt from this as far as weapons are concerned (assuming the weapon itself is not unique-equipped).

...

We’re working on this, but ideally:

• If you control a 398 ‘Cool Dragon Ring’ with any tertiary, you cannot roll need on another 398 ‘Cool Dragon Ring’ without a tertiary. It only works one way.
• This is a little under the hood, but we’re working towards it being so that not all tertiaries are considered equal - it’s valid for a healer to want to roll for an item with leech or some players to roll on an item with a socket, even if they have that exact item and level but it has say, Speed or Indestructible. We’ll see how this works long-term but some version of that is the idea.

And yes, Loot Spec will be set via the character pane under ‘Loot Options’ as it is currently.

[VictorVakaras 83]

They're seriously going forward with group loot in LFR? Do they even play their own game?

[SidonisAntares 290]

7 hours ago, VictorVakaras said:

They're seriously going forward with group loot in LFR? Do they even play their own game?

Man I'm going to queue LFR just for the drama now.

[JaggedGaze 0]

Yep, way more drama with need/greed. And really, why is current gear iLvl not included in whether or not someone can "Need" on an item.

Example of friends coordinating to essentially steal gear from people. IE: Person A, who can Need roll and actually needs the gear.  Has the same loot spec as person B, who can also Need roll, but DOES NOT actually need an item (ex: they have 291 item, item up for grabs is 249). However they have a friend in that raid, person C, who CAN NOT roll need on the item due to spec. So person B rolls Need, even though they don't, win's and gives the item to person C.  Thus allowing person C, to get gear for multiple specs. The only person who actually needs the item and can "Need" roll on it, doesn't get the gear.

You want to fix it:

1) Look at Spec plus current item level of gear they are wearing.  No one wearing a piece 20+ items levels above what is being rolled on, needs that item. Sure it's possible it might fit the secondary stats they want better, however the loss of primary stats from iLvl will be a bigger impact.

2) Prevent trading of items won based upon a Need roll, to individuals who are off spec for that item. Before the item is offered to another person who could have also Need rolled.

The fact someone can need roll on something they don't need. And then trade that item to anyone, is a broken feature.  If that person wants to give it up, it should go to the next highest Need roll.

[Pandariamist 8]

20 hours ago, JaggedGaze said:

Yep, way more drama with need/greed. And really, why is current gear iLvl not included in whether or not someone can "Need" on an item.

Example of friends coordinating to essentially steal gear from people. IE: Person A, who can Need roll and actually needs the gear.  Has the same loot spec as person B, who can also Need roll, but DOES NOT actually need an item (ex: they have 291 item, item up for grabs is 249). However they have a friend in that raid, person C, who CAN NOT roll need on the item due to spec. So person B rolls Need, even though they don't, win's and gives the item to person C.  Thus allowing person C, to get gear for multiple specs. The only person who actually needs the item and can "Need" roll on it, doesn't get the gear.

You want to fix it:

1) Look at Spec plus current item level of gear they are wearing.  No one wearing a piece 20+ items levels above what is being rolled on, needs that item. Sure it's possible it might fit the secondary stats they want better, however the loss of primary stats from iLvl will be a bigger impact.

2) Prevent trading of items won based upon a Need roll, to individuals who are off spec for that item. Before the item is offered to another person who could have also Need rolled.

The fact someone can need roll on something they don't need. And then trade that item to anyone, is a broken feature.  If that person wants to give it up, it should go to the next highest Need roll.

I agree they really need to fix the group loot system it's broken.

I've ran a hunter through for the denars and a rogue and so far off 2 upgrade drops for my hunter a chest that I lost the roll to naatyli-moonguard who had equipped a 275 mythic+ chest piece and a plate wearer that lost shoulders to beerez-blade's edge who had equipped 268 pvp shoulders.

Then on my rogue I lost a roll for wrists to lilazydrood-hyjal who had equipped 304 mythic+ wrists. I mean seriously blizzard needs to fix that asap they should not be able to roll on items that are lower than what they have equipped or did i read their rolling on items rule wrong ???

Edited October 28, 2022 by Pandariamist

[Stax 0]

What have do enchanters , they need epics for mats aswell, when they never get same item they never had mats for it,personal was better .