What is the best spec combination for Highmaul?

[Paracel 165]

So, hi everyone again!

I used Destro/Demo for raid weeks 1-3 and it was K.
Week 4, however, I tried Affli/demo and it was surprisingly good, even though I've played Affli for the 1st time since Cata!
But at all my Demo fights (Kargath on stands, Tectus and Bracken) I sucked I wasn't satisfied with my performance

 Which specs do You use in Highmaul and why? Either because of balance, encounter mechanics of just of pure fun - I'd like to hear your opinions! ^_^

[Liquidsteel 279]

You can get by as Destro / Demo. For a new boss you obviously should switch to the most optimal spec. I'll list below my opinions on the fights from a Mythic perspective.

 

Kargath - Destruction (Affliction still has the DoT bug?)

 

Twin Ogron - Affliction with SB:H or Demonology with Cataclysm

 

Brackenspore - Destruction due to Spore Shooters

 

Tectus - Demonology with Cataclysm.

 

Ko'ragh - Whatever you want. If you need more physical go Demo, if you need more magical go Afflic or Destro.

 

Butcher - Affliction with Shards of Nothing should come out top, but you can play anything with a focus on Single Target.

 

Imperator - Destruction.

[Paracel 165]

@Liquid, is an Affli on Tectus is a no go? I felt OK there with Affli with Cataclysm.

Will an Affli/Destro combination make it through? :) 
 

[Liquidsteel 279]

If you're doing 1 shard at a time Affliction is ok, but on Mythic you kill both and end up with 10 targets for about 30s then the fight is over. So no, Affliction is pretty terrible for Mythic Tectus due to ramp up time and lack of AoE.

 

Afflic / Destro is fine and will make it through no problem. I still advise Demonology for Mythic Tectus at least, but that's one fight.

[spikeysquad 50]

If you are only going with 2 specs personally I have found Affliction and Destro to be the most valuable over all. I think part of that is though that I just tend to perform better with Affliction than Demo (even having played the latter more). Just to be clear though I am not in mythic yet nor that good honestly so my thoughts may change with more experience and time.

 

Once I get to actually progressing on Tectus again I will see what I perform better with and what kind of difference there is to see if I will keep switching to Demo. Last time I did the fight (normal) with Affliction I was actually within about 2k of my Demo dps but yes I realise that is because I play Demo poorly/only averagely (and had a lot of clouds) not because they are really that close.

[Paracel 165]

Thank you for your response, friends!
Got to l2p demo 

[JvChequer 43]

I'm heavily considering change to Demo main and Destro off with Mastery enchantings since fights where Destro shines are aoe/cleave fights like Imperator and Brackenspore and the other, most of them Demo locks are better.

[Liquidsteel 279]

I went Mastery from the start, but I'm a spec whore and like to switch between all 3 on a constant basis.

Sims also showed no real gain for me in switching to crit even for Destruction.

[Virzaol 0]

Liquid - Destruction with Havoc cleave is outdone by Demo with Cataclysm on Twin Orrin? For real?

[Zagam 1,982]

Liquid - Destruction with Havoc cleave is outdone by Demo with Cataclysm on Twin Orrin? For real?

For Mythic, you must consider the heavy movement requirement.  Also, look at WCL reports on fights.  Destruction is one of the worst specs for this fight.

[Virzaol 0]

*Ogron. Stupid autocorrect...

Yea, I know it's a big movement fight. I just assumed that being able to get off one CB cleave every 15sec would still be preferable. I'll check out WCL though - thanks!

[Liquidsteel 279]

You're being pretty optimistic if you think you can get off a CB every 15s and still have enough embers to dump during Dark Soul. You'll likely have to swap between using Havoc for embers and chaos bolts.

[Virzaol 0]

Yea that's probably a good point as well. We're still working on Heroic at the moment, so I'm sure I'll see exactly what you're saying in practice soon enough. Appreciate the replies man!

[Karigg 0]

If you're doing 1 shard at a time Affliction is ok, but on Mythic you kill both and end up with 10 targets for about 30s then the fight is over. So no, Affliction is pretty terrible for Mythic Tectus due to ramp up time and lack of AoE.

 

Afflic / Destro is fine and will make it through no problem. I still advise Demonology for Mythic Tectus at least, but that's one fight.

We played demo for our first kill, but it turned out Destro with Charred remains was a lot stronger for the zerg strat. 

 

This might make spec choices easier for those who don't want to keep demo for just Tectus. 

 

We didn't know the zerg strat was possible until seeing Method's kill, so going into the instance with Destro/Demo made sense. In hindsight, we would have specced Afflic/Destro. Affliction wasn't necessary for any particular fight that demo couldn't take care of, but with current tuning, affliction is slightly stronger for Twins and Butcher and should be a better choice. 

 

Shame that makes gearing more awkward, but without many choices it won't matter anyway. Expecting Aff/Destro to be ideal for most fights in BRF also, but more on that after progression is over.

Edited January 2, 2015 by Karigg

[Liquidsteel 279]

That's interesting because I'm Affliction / Destro at the moment, and can't really be bothered taking Demonology for one fight as we want to clear back to Imperator as quickly as possible today.

 

I was going to play Destruction with Cataclysm but I suppose I can give Charred Remains a go. I still feel Demonology would be a better spec for progression considering all you really need to actually cast is Cataclysm and everything else is instant. Would make damage more consistent across the pulls.

[gahhda 95]

That's interesting because I'm Affliction / Destro at the moment, and can't really be bothered taking Demonology for one fight as we want to clear back to Imperator as quickly as possible today.

 

I was going to play Destruction with Cataclysm but I suppose I can give Charred Remains a go. I still feel Demonology would be a better spec for progression considering all you really need to actually cast is Cataclysm and everything else is instant. Would make damage more consistent across the pulls.

 

Demo is better on tectus because of the movement in the last phase. Destruction might come close to the demo aoe (which it, in reality, actually doesn't) if the 8 mote zerg wasn't a complete cluster fuck. There are some parses where destro locks got decent rng on movement and topped meters in last phase, but I prefer the reliability of chaos wave.

[Furyio 3]

Tried Demo on our run Sunday and it was an absolute embarrasment. Went back Destro for heroic. Affliction I havn't looked into at all this expansion. Not seeing any compelling evidence to make me consider it. 

 

I'd be comfortable in all three specs, but was suprised how rubbish Demonology was considering all the talk I'm hearing about it 

[Paracel 165]

How Demo feels right now? Seems that we talked it a lot since the release but then somehow most of us went to Aff/Destro in the result. <_>
Very interested in your's Imperator, Kargath and Butcher experience, fellow Demo players (the ones we prefer sth over Demo, actually). It can't be just "one fight is best' spec.



Also, why everyone are this hard on Destro? ~90%of wlocks I see on my server/around all RU realms are Destro(but not me).
SoO flashbacks? Playerbase from SoO being very conservative? One-trick-ponies?
Havoc cleave OP? Shadowburns?_{my adds are dying too quiclky even for one~_~}
#TerrorguardDPS ?

Or it's just me, not being able to play "easiest spec in-game" which is actually the best now? Even though RoF was killed and they buffed every other button of Demo&Affli for ~25%? In. The. Same. Hotfix?

Edited January 6, 2015 by Paracel

[Infernity 0]

I think most of us ended up gearing for destro just because of how strong it is for dungeons and CMs, and considering that's how we geared, that's just how it's ended up, rather than it being an actual choice.  I know for me personally, it was that reason anyway.

[spikeysquad 50]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/6/#dataset=90&aggregate=amount

 

Have a fiddle with the percentiles, item level, boss fights and their difficulty and you will see the general trend of what works best on each fight though some do not have that many parses yet.

 

Though I would say Destro is my least liked spec I do think it is strong on burst add damage on Brackenspore and on Imperator hence it is my "offspec''. I do like Destro but I do not really love it. I tend to think the lack of mobility bothers me and perhaps the simplicity but I do not really know what it is. As to my main I switch between Demo and Affliction and I am still(!) deciding what to focus on. Ideally it would be Demo I think which overall is better but I do not feel that I play it as well as I play Affliction.

 

I think with Demo it's perhaps a risk-reward thing, I have actually had my best Butcher result with Demo and my best Tectus. Then the next week on Tectus I dropped 5k and was 3k under my best Affliction attempt. So if I play well I am ok/good, if I play poorly then I am better with another spec and I think that I prefer consistancy. Of course this may just be lucky RNG and with another 100 hours or something of practice this may change but for me learning/improving my Demo play has been terribly slow compared to any other spec/game I have ever played.

 

You could be right Infernity but from what I gather secondary stats mean so little (or at least Mastery will benefit all) and therefore gear should not be a barrier in changing/switching spec so early on in this expansion.  

Edited January 6, 2015 by spikeysquad

[Zagam 1,982]

Tried Demo on our run Sunday and it was an absolute embarrasment. Went back Destro for heroic. Affliction I havn't looked into at all this expansion. Not seeing any compelling evidence to make me consider it. 

 

I'd be comfortable in all three specs, but was suprised how rubbish Demonology was considering all the talk I'm hearing about it 

Demo isn't rubbish - but it is VERY different and much more difficult than Affliction or Destruction.  Demonology requires practice, timing, effort, and coordination - things the other two specs lack. 

 

How Demo feels right now? Seems that we talked it a lot since the release but then somehow most of us went to Aff/Destro in the result. <_>

Very interested in your's Imperator, Kargath and Butcher experience, fellow Demo players (the ones we prefer sth over Demo, actually). It can't be just "one fight is best' spec.

Also, why everyone are this hard on Destro? ~90%of wlocks I see on my server/around all RU realms are Destro(but not me).

SoO flashbacks? Playerbase from SoO being very conservative? One-trick-ponies?

Havoc cleave OP? Shadowburns?_{my adds are dying too quiclky even for one~_~}

#TerrorguardDPS ?

Or it's just me, not being able to play "easiest spec in-game" which is actually the best now? Even though RoF was killed and they buffed every other button of Demo&Affli for ~25%? In. The. Same. Hotfix?

Flavor of the Month Warlocks in SoO who still remain continue to be Destruction because of how easy/good Destruction was in SoO.  Since it's still good, and VERY easy to play, most Warlocks continue their reign as Destruction.  Warlocks who have been Warlocks since Vanilla tend to drop back to Affliction because that's just who they are.  They came here for KJC and have stuck it out or re-rolled. 

 

I put up 99%ile parses as all 3 specs in SoO and have been bouncing between all 3 so far and have pushed comparable numbers.  Granted, I'm a better Demo Warlock than any other spec, so I'm biased (I also enjoy the complexity), but what I've listed is why I think you see a lot of Destro/Aff or purely one spec Warlocks.

 

I think most of us ended up gearing for destro just because of how strong it is for dungeons and CMs, and considering that's how we geared, that's just how it's ended up, rather than it being an actual choice.  I know for me personally, it was that reason anyway.

This, too.  No one likes being a crapper in dungeons.  Thankfully, once you get out of Heroic dungeon progression, you no longer need to even go in dungeons, so your spec decisions can come for raiding and PvP.

[Infernity 0]

Trinkets for destro were easer to get our hands on, with DMF and CC, both being gold available too now i think about it.

[Soulzar 42]

Tried Demo on our run Sunday and it was an absolute embarrasment. Went back Destro for heroic. Affliction I havn't looked into at all this expansion. Not seeing any compelling evidence to make me consider it. 

 

I'd be comfortable in all three specs, but was suprised how rubbish Demonology was considering all the talk I'm hearing about it 

 

Strange, I've been playing Demo almost exclusively and am absolutely loving it.  I recently dropped Destruction as offspec for Affliction for a change as I don't see requiring Destruction again until we get to Mythic Imp.. which is several weeks away.

 

We are currently working on Brackenspore, and I have been playing Demo for it despite it being a tailor made Destro fight.  

 

I love Destro, but have neglected Affliction too long and want to have it as a spec to mess with, and Demo is handling itself just fine for everything else.  

[Paracel 165]

@Infernity, I think gearing is not the issue. We just can't get all the right stats from Highmaul raid, not enough real choice.

I think it's resource stability that makes Destro better for a big amount of players.
Demonbolt rotation is  very easy to mess up, and Soulshards are bugged RNG. 
Embers are just, you know, generated with each cast  

[Stunlocked 8]

In addition to what Zagam said, people are hard on Destruction because of it's reputation as the 'easy' spec.  I don't necessarily think it's true any more: I don't think it's that much easier than Affliction nowadays (at least on single target).  But in Wrath (and I think Cataclysm) there wasn't much to it: you just had to keep Immolate and Doom up as DoTs (and since Doom had a minute duration it wasn't hard), cast Chaos Bolt & Conflag off cooldown, and spam Incinerate in the meantime.  Corruption went in and out of the rotation, but wasn't a huge part of it. 

 

The revamp before Mists, with the addition of Burning Embers as a resource and trying to time Chaos Bolt it with cooldowns/procs added some complexity, as did the addition of Havoc.   I still wouldn't call it 'difficult', but there is certainly more thought and complexity in it than there used to be.