Unsure about what stat priority, need a little enlightment.

[Zagam 1,982]

If you just math it out, it's pretty tough to maintain without RoF.  Each cast of FnB costs 1 BE.  If you have a 20% crit rate, hitting 5 targets will generate 0.5 BE if 0 crit.  With a 20% crit rating, you can expect one to crit, so you get 0.6 BE per cast.  At that rate, you're losing 0.4 BE per cast.

 

If you're at 20% with 6 targets, you will get 0.6 BE back if 0 crit and 0.7 back if one crits. 

With 7 targets, you'll get 0.7 back with a good chance of 0.8 and a low chance of 0.9.

 

At 8 targets with 25% crit, you hit a breakpoint where you SHOULD be able to sustain FnB.  With 8 targets, you get 0.8 guaranteed and have 25% chance on 8 tries to get 2 successful tries.  At this point, RNG could screw you or it could benefit you, but at 25% Crit, you're looking at 8 targets.

 

If you have 50% Crit with Dark Soul up and 5 targets, you're likely to get back 0.7 or 0.8.  With 6 targets, you're likely to get back 0.9.  At 7 targets, you finally "break-even" with an expected return of 1.0-1.1 BE. 

 

Even with Dark Soul, you're kinda screwed.  (note, all of this is without Immolate, so expected results slightly better, but not by much)

 

TL;DR - Blizzard completely fucked Destruction AoE by overgutting an ability that simply needed a small damage nerf. 

[Liquidsteel 279]

Don't forget Incinerate has an extra 20% chance to crit via the perk.

[Noveliss 1]

If you just math it out, it's pretty tough to maintain without RoF.  Each cast of FnB costs 1 BE.  If you have a 20% crit rate, hitting 5 targets will generate 0.5 BE if 0 crit.  With a 20% crit rating, you can expect one to crit, so you get 0.6 BE per cast.  At that rate, you're losing 0.4 BE per cast.

 

If you're at 20% with 6 targets, you will get 0.6 BE back if 0 crit and 0.7 back if one crits. 

With 7 targets, you'll get 0.7 back with a good chance of 0.8 and a low chance of 0.9.

 

At 8 targets with 25% crit, you hit a breakpoint where you SHOULD be able to sustain FnB.  With 8 targets, you get 0.8 guaranteed and have 25% chance on 8 tries to get 2 successful tries.  At this point, RNG could screw you or it could benefit you, but at 25% Crit, you're looking at 8 targets.

 

If you have 50% Crit with Dark Soul up and 5 targets, you're likely to get back 0.7 or 0.8.  With 6 targets, you're likely to get back 0.9.  At 7 targets, you finally "break-even" with an expected return of 1.0-1.1 BE. 

 

Even with Dark Soul, you're kinda screwed.  (note, all of this is without Immolate, so expected results slightly better, but not by much)

 

TL;DR - Blizzard completely fucked Destruction AoE by overgutting an ability that simply needed a small damage nerf. 

All they need to do is make crits give embers again

[gahhda 95]

If you just math it out, it's pretty tough to maintain without RoF.  Each cast of FnB costs 1 BE.  If you have a 20% crit rate, hitting 5 targets will generate 0.5 BE if 0 crit.  With a 20% crit rating, you can expect one to crit, so you get 0.6 BE per cast.  At that rate, you're losing 0.4 BE per cast.

 

If you're at 20% with 6 targets, you will get 0.6 BE back if 0 crit and 0.7 back if one crits. 

With 7 targets, you'll get 0.7 back with a good chance of 0.8 and a low chance of 0.9.

 

At 8 targets with 25% crit, you hit a breakpoint where you SHOULD be able to sustain FnB.  With 8 targets, you get 0.8 guaranteed and have 25% chance on 8 tries to get 2 successful tries.  At this point, RNG could screw you or it could benefit you, but at 25% Crit, you're looking at 8 targets.

 

If you have 50% Crit with Dark Soul up and 5 targets, you're likely to get back 0.7 or 0.8.  With 6 targets, you're likely to get back 0.9.  At 7 targets, you finally "break-even" with an expected return of 1.0-1.1 BE. 

 

Even with Dark Soul, you're kinda screwed.  (note, all of this is without Immolate, so expected results slightly better, but not by much)

 

TL;DR - Blizzard completely fucked Destruction AoE by overgutting an ability that simply needed a small damage nerf. 

 

Destruction aoe seems perfectly fine on the 3 fights with actual 8+ target aoe, also the only 3 fights with any form of aoe at all.

 

Side note, don't use simc multi-target destruction stuff right now. Apparently collision exploded havoc a few days ago without telling me and now the whole thing is crumbling l0l.

 

Ignore that last bit, apparently my git was just being a little bitch and not properly merging.

Edited January 5, 2015 by gahhda

[Jaypwee 0]

From what I remember, we had a hotfix during SoO where we get bonus embers from Incinerates and Conflagrates.

 

5.4.1 Hotfixes: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/blog/10932273

 

I don't know if this buff carried on to WoD, but shouldn't this alleviate our ember starve during AoE fights? I'm posting this because I had sustain ember regen from 5 targets with DS for trash. (My crit was at approximately 50%). 

Edited January 6, 2015 by Jaypwee

[Liquidsteel 279]

Fairly certain those were removed.

[Zagam 1,982]

Don't forget Incinerate has an extra 20% chance to crit via the perk.

What perk is this?  I know Doom has an extra 20% - Incinerate has one, too?  I thought Destruction's perks were Havoc, CB cast, Immolate damage, and Ember Tap?

[gahhda 95]

What perk is this?  I know Doom has an extra 20% - Incinerate has one, too?  I thought Destruction's perks were Havoc, CB cast, Immolate damage, and Ember Tap?

 

That got nuked half way into beta, about the time I told them it was fucking stupid to have a spec based on crit, give it a free +20% crit, and then make gosac +25% crit.

[Zagam 1,982]

So it doesn't exist, right?  Or did I miss something?  I'm not seeing a 20% higher crit rate with Incinerate on my logs...

[Deamux 4]

Significance is determined by your investment in small numbers, and your understanding of realistic fights.

 

They both lose nearly the exact same amount on a single target. The difference comes when you factor in multi-target fights.

 

Crit scales extremely well for small target demonology fights due to doom generating a vast majority of our demonic fury. It even keeps up in value with mastery for sustained aoe, which is very unrealistic. If you need to burst adds down, mastery will clearly win, but there aren't really any fights outside of tectus where you would be using chaos wave. Possibly kor'agh, too.

 

Destruction multi-target, on the other hand, is incredibly reliant on large quantities of crit to sustain ember generation. This is particularly true for large scale aoe (6+).

 

The value of crit on 2 targets for destruction, as an example, is 17.9% ahead of mastery.

On 8 targets, that value increases to a full third higher.

 

The value of mastery on 2 targets for demonology is 4.25% ahead of crit.

On 8 targets, that value stagnates around 3.8%.

 

It is true that enchants make up a relatively small portion of stat budget, and therefore you are unlikely to achieve gains larger than 2-3% on a single target. Multi-target that value might go up to something as high as 5%, but probably not more than that. This is much more applicable to over-all gearing choices than just enchants.

 

This is very interesting since I dont really play affliction. I'm also pretty sure, unless heaven falls down, that i'll be playing those 2 specs in blackrock. Do you have any idea how these stats will change by then, or is that too soon? I chose Mastery > haste > crit in Highmaul (not really perfect it seems but ok.) but i'll probably go for Mastery = Crit > haste or even Crit > mastery > haste like you recommend in blackrock.

[Liquidsteel 279]

Oh my bad. I thought it still had that perk.

I've said this previously and not been pulled up on it \○/

[Zagam 1,982]

Oh my bad. I thought it still had that perk.

I've said this previously and not been pulled up on it \○/

Leave it to me to have to bust your balls.  Everyone else is scared of your blue name ;)